Massively OP Podcast: Episode 2

Massively Overpowered’s first week in operation couldn’t have come at a more turbulent time in the industry. Fortunately, the podcast team of Bree and Justin are here to guide you through all of the earthshattering news that happened this past week, including the Daybreak layoffs and WildStar’s precarious situation.

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saboteursweden
Guest
saboteursweden

MatthewRiddle The idea of openworld PvP “if you want to” sounds awesome. I had those moments on WoW PvE servers odly, if I saw a fight I could choose to join or not. Today the gear- and levelgrind in WoW is too much for me. If I miss the battlegrounds I jump into Heroes of the Storm or GW2 SPvP.

saboteursweden
Guest
saboteursweden

Another good one, keep ’em coming please!

Greaterdivinity
Guest
Greaterdivinity

MikedotFoster Also, dishonorable kills. Those things damn near killed my guilds city/outpost raids because a few dishonorable kills would wreck the honor standings (or was it still contribution points back then?) for those of us that were doing the Rank 11-14 grinds.

SallyBowls1
Guest
SallyBowls1

RagnarTheDrunk TomTurtle I see it as “extortion not entitlement”  The overwhelming majority of gamers do not post in any forum or fansite; so they never whine or complain.  They. in fact, do just go find another game.  It’s when the developers want to finance their AAA budget that they find out what the customer want and will pay for. No game was ever made more solo/pve/casual friendly by a player; the changes are made by developers who want to change their product into one that more people will pay for. The developers would need to make those changes even if no player ever once voiced a complaint/whine in a forum. It’s the Golden Rule – those with the gold make the rules.

SallyBowls1
Guest
SallyBowls1

Syppi KenAddeh Grats! Just think that today you are living your future “Follow your Bliss” advice to him.

SallyBowls1
Guest
SallyBowls1

TomTurtle kofteburger Yes, but the converse is not true.  You could develop Landmark and “hiatus” all the EQN-only bits.  They would have to be in huge trouble to do that though as the uproar would be deafening.

SallyBowls1
Guest
SallyBowls1

melissamcdon I was so jazzed, especially about Story Bricks.  But my cold shower back to sobriety was the twitch/console combat.  I still hope it is successful but it clearly is not for me.

ProgenySun
Guest
ProgenySun

Sooooooo frickin happy you guys are still around after the end of the joystiq era.

dionm01
Guest
dionm01

melissamcdon dionm01 My rebuttal in Audio Form. Enjoy. Sorry for the long rant.
DIonsol

melissamcdon
Guest
melissamcdon

dionm01 Ironically, in almost all other ways, STO is basically Pirates of the burning Sea in space.

melissamcdon
Guest
melissamcdon

kofteburger They could remedy that simply by giving us actual avatars that aren’t fugly little hobbits who can only wear boy’s clothing. 
I’m sick and tired of the “it’s only beta” excuse.  
Landmark’s handling of avatars and its penchant for unisex clothing is a dismal failure.    And I was a huge apostle for the game, originally.  When it was Everquest branded.   Because that carried the promise of multiple races, etc., stuff we haven’t got in Landmark.

melissamcdon
Guest
melissamcdon

it’s just sad how jazzed up I was about EQN and even Landmark, and how cold my blood has gotten since.

Syppi
Guest
Syppi

KenAddeh That’s all he does these days, run around giggling like a madman. It’s pretty entertaining.

Rebel Engie
Guest
Rebel Engie

Liandreth 
Maybe it was the fact that it took 100 shotgun blasts to kill anything. :(

Rebel Engie
Guest
Rebel Engie

breetoplay RagnarTheDrunk
This post gave me a nostalgia sugar rush.

KenAddeh
Guest
KenAddeh

Dat giggling. God, my heart warmed from it’s cold slumber hearing that giggle.

As well as that, great podcast again :D

Rebel Engie
Guest
Rebel Engie

Syppi 
Will Bree’s SWG evangelirants made available on a Special Edition release?
These are my all time favourite bits!  
65k stretch goal maybe? 
<3

breetoplay
Guest
breetoplay

CrowingOne They’re getting attention for a couple of reasons: The people involved are veteran devs, and the effort into the game’s design from its teasers is already obvious. Anyway, I can’t say more, but it’s clear that gameplay stuff is coming. :P

breetoplay
Guest
breetoplay

RagnarTheDrunk Honestly, I always joined a faction with my characters just so I could figure out who around me was in the same faction (also for the faction ships). I didn’t PvP on any of my characters but my smuggler. It was totally possible to join the rebels, stay covert forever and ever, and be safe from PvP. You just had to watch the types of missions you took, take care in cities where lots of enemy NPCs were, etc. If you opened fire on an NPC stormtrooper, it would blow your covert status temporarily. So if you wanted your chef to be an imp, you did it… you just didn’t go to Moenia and mess with rebel commandos where imperials might see you. :P

breetoplay
Guest
breetoplay

EatCandy breetoplay Tierless I don’t follow you. Trammel added a completely safe copy of the entire world to a game that had been previously full gank-and-open-loot PvP. Of course it was popular with everyone but the gankers who preferred to gank PvE players. (To add insult to injury, Trammel was made pretty and Felucca was made ugly, visually.)
The SWG model had nothing at all to do with that. The real nasty ganker types didn’t come to SWG in the first place because there was no ganking to be had.

MikedotFoster
Guest
MikedotFoster

TomTurtle omedon666 Find exercise you can love! That’s the secret to staying in great shape, loving the hell out of your workouts.

MikedotFoster
Guest
MikedotFoster

Ironwu It’s worth noting that Crossroads was a NOTORIOUS PvP area despite being Horde territory, meaning the Horde participants were voluntarily flagging themselves even on PvP servers. World PvP took a major hit with the introduction of battlegrounds, but it was the dungeon-finder that really sank it.

MikedotFoster
Guest
MikedotFoster

CrowingOne Syppi Rebel Engie We forgot to mention that random audio clips are our $125,000 stretch goal.

Reihen
Guest
Reihen

breetoplay Regarding Crowfall, the exchange of patron status for gold (RMT) doesn’t (shouldn’t) automatically corrupt the economy. Please bear in mind that the servers reset once a faction wins the map so any excess wealth that exists, at the end of each round, will be purged. It’s sort of like what EVE online does, except different…better actually (execution permitting).

To elaborate:
Crowfall won’t actually have an official in-game currency, it uses an in-game bartering system instead (which will help to quell the Chinese farmers).
Tully – “We are giving the players the tools of an economy but what becomes the defacto unit for trade will be decided by what people start selling their goods for. Could be wood, ore, ore smelted into coins, if so which ore is the one used?”

So why RMT if the gold disappears each round?
* Successful players with in-game wealth can spend in-game currency to buy subscription status.
* The person that isn’t wealthy in-game can buy subscription status and sell it to others so that they have some form of currency.
Ideally, this helps to keep the scales of battle even between those that have a full-time job and those that can afford to invest 40 hours of playtime a week. 
Summary – The person with a job can pay for patron, the person who’s job is to play can earn patron. 
The RMT system also helps to keep the Chinese Farmers completely at bay by keeping funds in the hands of the developer instead of overseas farming operation. So far, with what little information we have, Patron status will only be used to allow players to be able to build structures throughout the world(s)

So is Gold even relevant?
Kinda, sorta.
Because they are using Voxel Farms and the worlds being procedurally generated, the locations of various valuable resources will be shuffled with each round that passes. They have stated that there will be mines in certain parts of the map that other factions won’t have access to and unlike other titles, players can actually harvest/mine the Gold in Crowfall and then melt into a form of currency.

To reiterate; some guilds will have access to different, highly desired resource nodes, that they will want to gather and trade for other resources (such as gold… or maybe wood because they are in a desert climate) because the map is setup to put valuable resources in the possession of certain kingdoms. This means guilds can befriend eachother to combine resources, or fight for resources until one guild swears fealty!

Hope this helps!
Living and breathing for the future of Crowfall and Camelot Unchained,
Drew

Zaeja
Guest
Zaeja

Delightful podcast as usual – thanks!
One thing I don’t really agree with Bree on though is the assumption that RMT automatically breaks the economy, or at least relegates it to the ‘not really serious’ territory. While I’m sure there are plenty of examples where real money -> virtual currency exchange has been implemented poorly, I think that usually tends to be compounding an already badly designed economy (ie, GW2 with terrible crafting integration/demand and excessive resource surplus – quite aside from being able to buy gold for gems).
My favourite MUD (Lusternia) had an incredibly serious economy, but was financed by a virtual currency (credits) that you could purchase out-of-game or in-game. A credit could be used either for special customization, purchasing utility/combat/decorative items from an item shop or converted into additional training for your character, and because they were kept highly valued and with a fairly high exchange rate (for example, some of the best items in the shop might take credits that would cost around $600 if purchased purely out-of-game), I always felt that they added to the economy rather than detracted from it. Many game systems depended on a functioning monetary system – there were treasury roles and assistants in each player-run city or class-based organization, and the player-designed craft and trade systems depended on there being a steady demand and profitability of goods. That virtual currency also could only be traded for in-game money that other players had gathered in-game, so along with the many one-way credit sinks there was no instant creation of money from ‘nothing’.
Of course if that system was replicated in today’s MMOs, there would be riots. It would be considered ridiculously expensive by the penny-pinching freemium crowd, not to mention heavily pay-to-win since it offered purchaseable combat upgrades alongside craft/cosmetic ones (gasp!). Still, I think there are probably other examples of good RMT out there, and linking that business model with ‘giving up’ on a complex, juicy economy makes as much sense as saying that player skill based combat automatically rules out good character development and combat complexity, just because there is an out-of-game input involved.

MatthewRiddle
Guest
MatthewRiddle

I’m with Bree 100%. One of the things I hate the MOST about MMOs is when they have a PvP only stat on gear. Thus those who PvP get a bunch of the stat and those who PvE get none of the stat. Then when the PvPer goes into PvP, they are gimped because their PvP stat doesn’t help, and when a PvEer goes into PvP they get roasted because none of their gear has the PvP stat.
It separates the players into two groups, forces them to choose between PvE or PvP or spending twice as much time as every other player to get a set of both. It’s stupid, and in any MMO that is losing players (basically all of them) it’s not smart to push half the players away from utilizing 100% of the content in the game.

RagnarTheDrunk
Guest
RagnarTheDrunk

Celestial I use Pocket Casts. There’s a web version and a mobile app that stay in sync. Massively OP is there too – I just added it.

RagnarTheDrunk
Guest
RagnarTheDrunk

TomTurtle RagnarTheDrunk
You’re right. I apologize for the tone of my response. I’m frustrated with the industry as a whole right now – the entitled gamers, the devs that cave in and make all the games generic, the monetization models that allow them to switch on the fly and keep the $$ I’ve invested… the whole situation.

Thank you for responding and discussing. I’ll be more mindful in the future.

TomTurtle
Guest
TomTurtle

RagnarTheDrunk I wasn’t putting words in your mouth. It’s called responding and discussing to what you described. If there’s a nuance I’m not catching onto, well, I’m not a mind reader.
Hopefully you can find a game, development team and community that fits your preferences. While I have no interest in what you described, I’m all for having more MMOs out there that appeal to various audiences.

RagnarTheDrunk
Guest
RagnarTheDrunk

TomTurtle No, no. Please don’t project or put words in my mouth. I have an issue with the entitled attitude shown by gamers. I have no issue with the devs – if I don’t like the rules, I’ll find something else to play.

TomTurtle
Guest
TomTurtle

RagnarTheDrunk Those people will always be there. It’s the developers who change the game based on that feedback that you have an issue with. Why is that? As I said, they have big budgets that require many active, paying players in game worlds that try to appeal to a wide audience. What I’m saying is if you want enthusiast games, as you described, developers of those types of games need to match their budget and audience accordingly.
You can’t go into business making a high budget game with non-mainstream designs and expect to survive. It doesn’t work. If you can’t tell, I’m agreeing with you that not every game needs to appeal to the majority gamer, but there are the aforementioned realities to keep in mind when choosing to design for a niche.

RagnarTheDrunk
Guest
RagnarTheDrunk

TomTurtle RagnarTheDrunk
I’m not sure how this relates to what I said. My comment was on players throwing hissy fits when a game has a rule or mechanic they don’t like instead of moving on and trying to find a game that fits them… which should be easy in this over saturated MMO market.
Not every game needs to have “majority gamers” as its market… ie, just because in someone’s mind “most players” like this or don’t like that doesn’t mean that every game should cater to what “most players” like. If the market actually worked that way there would be no products that catered to people of color and no businesses that catered to the LGBT crowd.

My point is that you wouldn’t go into a drag club screaming because you and your majority of people don’t like show tunes – you want country music… you’d move along to a bar that had country music.

Can you agree that there is room in this world for clubs that cater exclusively to Drag Show enthusiasts? If so, then surely there is room for games with full loot PvP and bosses that require more than just a solo player…. so instead of screaming and crying at the drag queens, people need to just move on and find a game with a ruleset that they like.

TomTurtle
Guest
TomTurtle

RagnarTheDrunk You have to factor the studios that have development costs that require a larger audience and who feel the need to make these changes to bring in more players. Games like Camelot Unchained are on a better track for creating a more narrowly defined game design. They don’t have to appeal to a wider audience since they kept the design focused and the budget matches accordingly.

TomTurtle
Guest
TomTurtle

kofteburger In my mind, one goes with the other. I don’t see how you could develop EQN without Landmark when its foundation is based on the latter in the first place.

TomTurtle
Guest
TomTurtle

omedon666 I save it for one of my exercise and workout periods. It really helps keep my mind off of how boring the physical activity is. :P

Gylnne
Guest
Gylnne

Very nice podcast, thank both very much.:)

Cyroselle
Guest
Cyroselle

Esoteric Coyote Cyroselle omedon666 Agreed! The idea that in order to craft weapons you first need to have weapons drop, which you then need to break combined with 2 other pieces of gear to make a single rune-thing, and to make a bow I need 3 tune-things… so that means I need 6 gear drops and 3 weapon drops total just to make the first tier bow…. 9 RNG-dependent drops… 
I’ve had 5 drops after grinding RNG for a week, and 4 of those were direct upgrades so I wouldn’t have sharded those…  Anyhow yes, terrible, terrible system, not well thought out, and about as clear as mud to new and returning (in my case) players alike!

RagnarTheDrunk
Guest
RagnarTheDrunk

Btw, Nice job on the podcast. I’m glad you’re still doing it!

RagnarTheDrunk
Guest
RagnarTheDrunk

The first thing I thought of when Bree mentioned how PvP worked in SWG was the crying:
“I don’t want to PvP but, but I want to be a member of the Rebel Alliance. It’s not fair that I can’t be a rebel just because I don’t want to PvP”

People feel so entitled now days that I’m not sure that you could have anything unique or cool about a specific faction and tie that to PvP status. People don’t just encounter rules and say “oh, ok, these are the rules of this game, this is how I’m going to play” Nope – the second they encounter something they want, be it a title, a color of uniform, a weapon or armor, that they can’t have because they solo or don’t like PvP or whatever they start up the QQ brigade and petition as hard as they can to get the rules changed.
That setup may have worked when SWG came out and MMORPGs were still niche and fully rooted in geek culture, but these days it’d just make people whine. Just look at any comments section for ANY game focused on PvP – people aren’t just skipping the game if they don’t like PvP, they actively whine to change the game to fit their wants.

Liandreth
Guest
Liandreth

Rebel Engie Liandreth You know, I tried my hardest to get into the TSW, but something was just holding us back.

Syppi
Guest
Syppi

Rebel Engie Don’t blame Jef, I’m mixing the podcast right now. I will try to do some clips in the future, but I ran out of time and had to get the podcast posted.

eLdritchMD
Guest
eLdritchMD

oh I should clarify though. I don’t want Crowfall to suffer the same fate as Shadowbane. I actually hope they do succeed. I hope all four of these games succeed because they all do something so vastly different and I find that so very exciting after years upon years of pretty much the same thing.

VeyV
Guest
VeyV

Rebel Engie
Actually I work in a startup company that is really nice and relaxed but because of that I don’t want to “disappoint” so I limit myself to audio and the occasional youtube video ; ) 
But on a general note I totally agree with that statement! :D

flatline4400
Guest
flatline4400

Larry’s Hairy Wing…
I cannot get that image out of my head!

Thanks MOP!  ;)

Hurbster
Guest
Hurbster

Grey backgroundddddddd. So good.

Hurbster
Guest
Hurbster

kofteburger Surely the two games should be as one ?

Hurbster
Guest
Hurbster

Nordavind Just imagine me putting a Xzibit picture here.

Nordavind
Guest
Nordavind

You forgot to mention an important aspect of TSW issue 10: Container keys!

There are a total of 14 side mission which gives you a Corrupted Biohazard Container. This container can drop a key (of white, green or blue rarity). These keys opens containers on the docks, and from them a boss spawn. The bosses might drop a purple bag with 1 of 3 epic gadgets (or a blue, green or white bag with other drops) which the min/maxers are crazy about getting.
A rather fun grind is I may add, but it’s RNG inside RNG with some more RNG. And a very low chance.

Nordavind
Guest
Nordavind

VeyV I am just like you in this aspect. I often drift away when it’s audio only, but this podcast (for it’s entire 2 episode span) are the first one I’m listening to. And I do it at work.

Esoteric Coyote
Guest
Esoteric Coyote

Cyroselle omedon666 I thankfully had the bow made and staff before the change.  I still haven’t been able to farm enough stuff to make the weapons I want.  It’s a terrible system, and I hope it changes.

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