World of Warcraft to allow flight in Draenor in a post-6.2 patch

If you had given up on flight as a lost cause in Warlords of Draenor, there's good news. World of Warcraft's developers posted a new development update today explaining the team's philosophy about flying once again while noting that players clearly do want to be able to fly.

The compromise reached is that players will be able to fly... if they work for it. In a post-6.2 patch, players who have achieved several pathfinding achievements, earned Revered reputation with the new 6.2 reputations, and collected all of the treasures on Draenor will be able to fly once again. The achievement is also account-wide, so earning it on one character will allow alts to fly as well. More details will be forthcoming, but it's still a victory for the players extremely displeased by the removal of flight.

Source: Dev Watercooler; thanks to Jose for the tip!
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474 Comments on "World of Warcraft to allow flight in Draenor in a post-6.2 patch"

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Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

ItsLorgarn Cosmic Cleric SoMuchMass  Replying here, as my post that you replied to, that I was notified via email, is not showing, and neither is your actual reply.  I'll quote it below first, then reply to it ...
"Cosmic Cleric ItsLorgarn SoMuchMass Thats weird, it does for me.
http://email.livefyre.com/wf/click?upn=2W-2Bk2xizUw-2BHtKwpdAjQ5-2BsAAZstQImQctIArNkLhU20IahjCtXFqkU8kQCK1wcU_CiNvZc8DktVycwG2RVqDtQAoPnvmN1rtReDzAdbtZH8Lk4FFl28M-2BED7koS0zTSoJOob9394srz4ZED2h-2FZYS4aEj-2BH5y8ES5flwN9OfkrfqqSy-2Ft45muKpIk9z0q920x4BND8jN9VeupShVbeMN52nqDeXFm3fVnMW9V-2Fu-2FpFBR9AzgFYYXuA31-2FF861rXyp5rHy0nZgxOSERFv8D4ALA-3D-3D
Might be some lightfyre bug, I've had troubles finding older comments previously as well."
My apologies, it seems that LiveFyre is broken.  I tried both Firefox and I.E. (don't have Chrome installed), and I could not find my post nor your reply that I just quoted above.  Unless of course its been modded away for some reason. /shrug

ItsLorgarn
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ItsLorgarn

Cosmic Cleric ItsLorgarn SoMuchMass Thats weird, it does for me.comment image
Might be some lightfyre bug, I've had troubles finding older comments previously as well.

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

ItsLorgarn Cosmic Cleric SoMuchMass Um, /golfclap ?

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

ManastuUtakata Midgetsnowman JLIHPodcast

I meant even in corporations., though. Its very rare that the majority is right, because in my experience with fellow humans, the majority tends to usually be a raving pack of angry mobs.

I'm a cynic, remember?

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

Cosmic Cleric Midgetsnowman MyNameIsIllegal Styopa Enikuo No, I'm not exaggerating, I'm grouping people I dont like together. There's a difference :P

excaliburlost
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excaliburlost

And so Blizzard continues a trend of compromises that leave no one happy. Anti-flight advocates will feel they caved, and those who wanted to fly will gain nothing really.

DasBenty
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DasBenty

Kass40 Yes, you learn flying at level 60. In Mists you can't fly there until level 90 I believe unless they changed that since I last played? Don't remember what the requirement is in Northrend, but each zone still had some barrier to entry. 
And don't fly in/out, no one is forcing you to do that. Not sure why people can't comprehend that, how you play is not how I play so don't take away features just because you don't want to use them.

ManastuUtakata
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ManastuUtakata

Styopa ManastuUtakata 
Well...that's really classy of you, lol.

ManastuUtakata
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ManastuUtakata

Loopstah ManastuUtakata 
If the decision is wrong, they need to ditch it. Haven't you guys learned anything from what happened to WildStar? /*Bleeping!* sheesh!

ManastuUtakata
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ManastuUtakata

Midgetsnowman ManastuUtakata JLIHPodcast 
False equivalence is false. We're talking about a game made by private company not a government laws or a court rulings. Don't conflate, as it's usually a sign of desperation at best and a troll at worst. And in the end, it makes the argument entirely invalid.

strongy_p
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strongy_p

Esoteric Coyote you only need 100 the 200 treasure achievement is currently the max one.

DelusionalRogue
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DelusionalRogue

Midgetsnowman ManastuUtakata JLIHPodcast Yes, bowing to the pressure of what players want is the wrong thing to do. How dare they actually listen to their customers!

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

MyNameIsIllegal Sythalin Cosmic Cleric Sutter Cane  Poor Sythalin , so worried that I am trying to imprison someone.  Listen, I can't help that someone shanked him in cell block C!

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

MyNameIsIllegal Sythalin Cosmic Cleric Sutter Cane  Poor Sythalin , so worried that I am trying to imprison someone.  Listen, I can't help that someone shanked him in cell block C!

MyNameIsIllegal
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MyNameIsIllegal

Sythalin Cosmic Cleric Sutter Cane Technically he would be inferring that you were going to get an actual knife. You would be implying. That said, continue :P

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Sutter Cane Cosmic Cleric Serrenity Sythalin "So, would I be wrong to presume that the box is 100% accurate? "
I think customers can assume that the box is accurate.  The onus is on the seller to make sure it is so.

Serrenity
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Serrenity

Cosmic Cleric Serrenity Sutter Cane Sythalin I don't work at Blizzard, and I don't know for certain.  I was just going off of the "technically, its been done in every other zone (but silvermoon ..or least it wasn't so technically, there wasn't a reason to cut it because the functionality was there.  
BUT not know the underpinnings of the game, I could be completely off.  Just inferring.

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Serrenity Cosmic Cleric Sutter Cane Sythalin "... as Blizz intentionally withheld this for design reasons. "
No disrespect, but you don't know this (unless you work at Blizzard?).  And there's allot of circumstantial evidence to suggest the opposite.

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Cosmic Cleric Serrenity Sutter Cane Sythalin Well, when I was working for "X" corporation in telecom, we had the same approach.    Once pre-orders hit our website for a new release, it was considered gold.  More features might be added later, but never cut.  

Blizzard has always had the attitude that they will release a product when it is "done".  They have scrapped years of work, like in Ghost.  So, would I be wrong to presume that the box is 100% accurate?

Serrenity
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Serrenity

Cosmic Cleric Serrenity Sutter Cane Sythalin I mean, we can argue this until were both blue in the face, like is flying considered a major feature, or ancillary -- I dunno.  I'm a product owner, and it sucked when we got right up to the line and I had to pull the feature, but it happened.  We launched, and apologized to the customers, and slated the feature for release later.  
Again, this situation isn't 100% the same, as Blizz intentionally withheld this for design reasons.

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Serrenity Sutter Cane Sythalin Cosmic Cleric I absolutely see your point of view.  However, you know this feature was in the game, they just decided to turn it off...

AGx
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AGx

JLIHPodcast Barely. Don't you understand why they don't want you to fly? By forcing you to do all that stuff before you can, they pretty much get their way. By the time you can fly, you''ll have nothing left to do.

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Serrenity Sutter Cane Sythalin Cosmic Cleric "Not that anyone will listen, but especially in software development, you
can't foresee everything and at somepoint some feature you talked about
will have to be cut.  There's no bait and switch, no maliciousness,
it's just the nature of software development."
As a software developer myself, I can tell you this, if we had to drop a major feature from the product, we would inform the client of this fact, and notify those who were using this feature previously, right away, and not drag our feet on it.  We would definitely not allow the packaging or app description suggest that the feature was still in, months and months after the product has shipped.

Serrenity
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Serrenity

Sutter Cane Serrenity Sythalin Cosmic Cleric But its not the same as a material product!  You can't keep saying things like that -- it's like comparing an apple to laundry detergent.  Sure, they are both things that you buy, but you wouldn't rate your laundry detergent on taste.  A fresh apple means something really different than fresh-smelling laundry detergent. 
I'm not petitioning for games to be able to say whatever they want, that would be silly.  And you are well within your purvey to be upset about how they handled this, but making wild comparisons and claiming false advertising is just crazy.  
Not that anyone will listen, but especially in software development, you can't foresee everything and at somepoint some feature you talked about will have to be cut.  There's no bait and switch, no maliciousness, it's just the nature of software development.  I've been days from release before and made the call to pull a promised feature because it wasn't where I wanted it to be.  Is that what happened in this particular case?  Probably not. but it has in lots of other cases.

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Lockeman Sutter Cane Sythalin Cosmic Cleric :)  I was hoping that the ACT wasn't lying about my read comprehension score.

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Cosmic Cleric Midgetsnowman Sutter Cane Sythalin gorkoswow Yeah, I think it is difficult to put ones self into the shoes of the offended, if one is apathetic to flying.  They have been arrogant about the issue, which is insulting for the customers paying Blizzard's bills.  It is a MAJOR feature.  Travel.

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Midgetsnowman MyNameIsIllegal Styopa Enikuo
One person's "absolutely petty" is another person's "really important".

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Sutter Cane Midgetsnowman /applaud

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Midgetsnowman Sutter Cane Cosmic Cleric Sythalin gorkoswow "We know deep down that flying is a really stupid-ass hill to die on."
Its not just about flying, but how a company treated their customers about that subject.  IMHO, some unethical stuff happened.

Cosmic Cleric
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Cosmic Cleric

Midgetsnowman Cosmic Cleric Sythalin Sutter Cane gorkoswow Selling someone a Cesna plane that would not fly, but only drive on a freeway, would not be something that someone would want, and could be argued in court, even if the seller never said that the plane would fly, or would only fly over certain airports but not everywhere else.
We're not going to decide here the legality of this, based on our not-being-lawyers, but I'd love to see this one in court, it has all the signs of something that would, pardon the pun, fly.

Lockeman
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Lockeman

Sutter Cane Sythalin Cosmic Cleric 
It does say "DESCEND from the skies on the back of a black-winged Dread Raven mount".
Which you can't do in the xpac this is being advertised for.
Just say'n. :-)

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

MyNameIsIllegal Midgetsnowman bryanjturner it wou;d be nice, but it rarely happens.

Styopa
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Styopa

ManastuUtakata Styopa Internet poster poses rhetorical question.  Complains about not getting answer.

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane
Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Midgetsnowman Luckily, this is just the interwebs!  I still stand by my premise in that they lied.  They were called out on it and reluctantly changed their stance.  The videos and screen captures from the first "flyer", I predict to be LOL.

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

Sutter Cane Sythalin gorkoswow You first

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Serrenity Sutter Cane Sythalin Cosmic Cleric Legal or not.  It is bad business and unethical.  If the feature makes the box, it is written and assumed to be in game.  The large software houses are so sleazy.  They can insert some clause in the fine print, saying "subject to change" and it clears them of all BS.  Sure, your links are valid.  How is one going to prove it unless someone is in the board room with a recording device?  If this was a "material" product, a retailer would have to give a refund and mark some of this buggy mess as defective.

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

Sutter Cane Cosmic Cleric Sythalin gorkoswow We know deep down that flying is a really stupid-ass hill to die on.

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

ManastuUtakata JLIHPodcast If bowing to pressure was always the right thing to do, then there'd be a lot of laws for both good and ill that should have long since passed.

Midgetsnowman
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Midgetsnowman

IcaruSS Well, thats the point, I think

the devs feel strongly that the content they designed is for ground play. This way when you have flying, you cant cheat your way out of that content

dionm01
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dionm01

IcaruSS It's sad to say, but I think you are correct and that is disappointing.  For me as a casual player, I don't have time to mess around and get every facet of faction grind and other requirements.  
I thought we were supposed to play the game to have "Fun" and not have to work all the time.  If I wanna work, I can do that in a real world and get money for it.  A lease that is in inflow and not outflow. 
I still think what is going to happen is as I said in my video (that probably nobody here will see in this forum) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkqn4VtzA1s that what will end up happening at the end of the expansion.  Is Blizzard will create a vendor and make the flying available at a healthy cost of gold that will be just enough that you'll have to buy what WOW tokens and sell those on the auction house to afford it.  I know im being cynical here and im sorry for that.  But I think Blizzard/Activision is worshiping the money god now more than ever now.
Personally I'm on the fence and waiting to see if that the last minute blizzard throws a vendor out.  I don't wanna waste my time faction grinding when in the end it's worthless in wasted a lot of my time when I can just go to a vendor (if that happens) and pay for and beyond my way in a zone that I won't care about because the new shiny will have been released by that point.  Bottom line, we as the world of warcraft player loses out from a casual players perspective.
One man's opinion
Dionsol
lvl 100 Dormant Undead grossly underpowered Warlock 
Terokkar US

Serrenity
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Serrenity

Sutter Cane Sythalin Cosmic Cleric False Advertising will never fly here: 

1) Supreme court decision indicating that false advertising only applies to competing businesses. 2) Precedence is now set against the concept of suing based on alleged 'promises' 
3) Most legal instances of 'False Advertising' have to include some degree of malicious intent - meaning they deliberately mislead consumers.  Most instances of game publication lacks this degree of maliciousness, and instead just happens throughout the normal course of development.   

http://www.gamefront.com/false-advertising-in-video-games-aliens-simcity-and-your-wallet/

http://videogamerlaw.com/tag/false-advertising/

http://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/lexmark-international-inc-v-static-control-components-inc/

Loopstah
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Loopstah

ManastuUtakata Loopstah Regardless of whether a decision is right or wrong, they need to stick to it. Either remove flying or don't. This neither-here-nor-there approach to everything they do is disappointing. It portrays the message that devs do not have the confidence nor integrity to stick to their guns and make the game THEY want to make - and instead do what the mouthbreathers are yelling for.

ManastuUtakata
Guest
ManastuUtakata

JLIHPodcast 
Yes, doing the right thing always seems ...disappointing for some.

ManastuUtakata
Guest
ManastuUtakata

Styopa ManastuUtakata 
And speaking of whining...so your answer to my question is yes I presume. <3

IcaruSS
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IcaruSS

The irony of their plan is that to unlock flight, one has to complete all of the content that Draenor has to offer.
Once all of the content has been exhausted there is no further reason to stay subbed, unless one is raiding or maintaining an army of alts.
Most casuals will jump through the hoops to re-earn flight, spend a weekend swooping around and taking screenshots, and then drop  sub because there is nothing left to do in the expansion.

Styopa
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Styopa

ManastuUtakata Styopa You seem to invest a lot of personal emotion into trivialities and ad-hominems?

I guess that works when the mods will cheerfully delete threads you start to lose?

Sutter Cane
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Sutter Cane

Sythalin Cosmic Cleric Sutter Cane Actually, implied can be used in court.  Luckily, we are just discussing the premise that buying a product (with a list of contents of said product) would give us access to all parts of said product.  This was the 2014 version and one would expect to be able to use the features of the 2014 product within THAT product.  

The old Blizzard stance...This would be like owning a 2012 and 2014 Mercedes and the company says some 2014 features can only be used in your 2012 car.  Yes, this example is absurd, but no more asinine than Blizzard's explanation.  

"Sorry Mercedes owner, you can only use the new GPS system in your 2012 car.  We are afraid this feature would break the immersion in your new car. You need to be GPS free to truly appreciate your new car. "

*public outlash*

"Well, we have decided you can use the feature you paid for after all, but you must ride every single road in your country to unlock the new GPS feature."

JLIHPodcast
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JLIHPodcast

They rolled to the pressure. Im disappointed.

extremexcarver
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extremexcarver

Resounding "meh".

wpDiscuz