EVE player uses $28,000 of skill injectors to create max character

We recently brought you the story of EVE Online player Stromgren who had bought almost $7,000 worth of skill injectors to become the highest-skilled character in the game overnight. A bizarre twist on that story has since emerged when another player named IronBank created a brand-new character and used around $28,000 worth of injectors to max out every possible skill he could acquire to level 5. A total of around 2,846 injectors were used to boost the new character up to 473,344,000 skill points that would normally take over 20 years of skill training time to acquire. Those injectors are currently worth over 1.7 trillion ISK or about 1,423 PLEX, which would currently cost between $21,161 and $28,446 to buy with cash.

The response from the EVE Online community has been understandably mixed. While some point out that having a max-skill character doesn’t provide any real benefit over a well-planned 30-50 million skill point character, others players feel that being able to create a three-day-old max character cheapens their own time investment in EVE. Players have also highlighted the fact that the player behind IronBank used the immense ISK profits from running a lucrative gambling website to fund the skill injectors, and he did it all live on stream to drum up further interest in his online gambling services.

Stromgren now sits at number 2 in the skill point rankings and has injected another 60 million skill points since our previous story, bringing his character up to 400 million skill points.

Source: EVE Forum, EVE Subreddit, (thanks to Cista Cista for the tip!)
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192 comments
pocketdimension
pocketdimension

i don't know  how literally blowing over 100 years of plex on a single character cheapens anything.

SallyBowls1
SallyBowls1

A PLEX lists for $20 and nosygamer "15,345 PLEX traded hands last Tuesday, the first day of the new skill point trading feature."  This does not include PLEXes that people bought and used themselves e.g. for Aurum / injectors. That is over $300k of PLEXes in one day. In the short term, this seems to be working for CCP.

Nyphur
Nyphur moderator

@SallyBowls1 This isn't the whole story, though. 15,345 PLEX may have been sold on the market, but how much higher is that than the baseline daily trades? That number also includes people buying and reselling them on the day in anticipation of demand or to create the illusion of higher demand, and it includes people who bought up in anticipation of the patch and then aggressively sold them after the patch, which may be a lot of people as prices actually dipped.

The truth is that it's impossible to glean actual Skill Extractor profits from data available on the EVE market, and since you can use PLEX and AUR already in the game to buy them, even CCP will have a hard time quantifying the impact. The best estimate would be produced by looking at the number of skill extractors created (a stat only CCP has access to), using average injector/aur/plex prices (again, which only CCP has), and just considering the elimination of PLEX liability to be a profit so we don't even have to consider that part of the market.

Denice J Cook
Denice J Cook

I imagine that, as subs keep dropping, CCP has to figure out how to farm the remaining player base for more money any way they can to keep the ship afloat, or keep it flying in space in this case.  ;)


Moreover, I'd rather hear about *this* kind of Eve drama than the "Mittens and the GMs try to get a player to commit suicide in real-life" kind any day of the week.  This year it seems that CCP has actually climbed up a level or two within Dante's Inferno.  ;)

Puiucs
Puiucs

@Denice J Cook are you high or something? the number of eve players has been on the rise for the past 3-4 months at a steady rate of growth. and with fanfest coming soon, a new big expansion and the huge amount of attention CCP will get from Eve Valk you can safely say that 2016 will be a big year for Eve Online.

Puiucs
Puiucs

@KaiserPhoenix @Denice J Cook it's not true. he's just a troll. he most likely lost a ship or something in the game and now he just likes to post stupid hate comments. the game is also getting quite a bit of new players lately. everybody knows that the game is growing again.

Zennie
Zennie

@Denice J Cook GMs tried to get a player to commit suicide. What?


I mean, I understand that you utterly hate EVE and want to badmouth it as much as possible, maybe someone exploded your spacepixels and it's very important for you. I have a protip: GMs also secretly murder  EVE players and harvest their organs.

JarmoSits
JarmoSits

@Denice J Cook Im not currently playing but will return when i get more time... and ur flame is inproper.. Eve playerbase is literally the same as it has been for years.. i started playing in Apocrypha.. im not even sure wich year that was... 2007 or 2008 ... ccp dealt with multiboxing and got riddof shit tons of bots.. despite that people online has relatively remained close to same... wich means the playerbase is slowly growing...   the current popularity of sci-fi genre is rising plays in the hands of CCP... i'm confident that Eve will outlive the World of Warcraft franchise... most booring and most epic game of all time (at the same time) ...  : )

LordSolarMacharius
LordSolarMacharius

I'm so glad I quit this game. This is just more reason to stay away. Bad enough just dealing with the sociopaths and developer incompetence. Now that they've made it more pay-to-win than most Asian FTP MMOs and still charge a subscription fee, I'm not giving them another cent.

Puiucs
Puiucs

@LordSolarMacharius i highly doubt that this can be considered pay to win. it's not like you can go past beyond lvl 5 in skills. and you only use just a few of them when you PVP.

you can have the best ships and max skills, you are still a nobody in eve when you play solo.

Adri Cortesia
Adri Cortesia

First thing: I never played EVE. But there are people like these in every MMO. People who wants to show off with things. But for me (beside the money I don't own) it wouldn't be a good goal. I love to evolve my character over time (time means more than 2 days!) just to be (yeah old-school) proud of it. 

Kanbe
Kanbe

And of course it would be someone that runs one of those gambling websites.

Matso
Matso

" Players have also highlighted the fact that the player behind IronBank used the immense ISK profits from running a lucrative gambling website to fund the skill injectors, and he did it all live on stream to drum up further interest in his online gambling services."

So?

Isnt that the capatilistic Eve economy with player created events,banks and gambling systems that all players usually praise. Now a player uses the money he made of it and at the same time generates interest for his venture (like any good capitalist should) and now they go full communist on him for some reason.

alexjwillis
alexjwillis

Rich people gonna spend. No news there. 


Will change precisely nothing for everyone else playing the game, except that maybe now this person -- whose character name is known -- will have a big target painted on their backs. One more person who doesn't know what they're doing prepping some expensive killmails for the gank squad. 


popcorn.gif



Tithian
Tithian

Absolutely pointless venture. Grats, I guess?

Styopa
Styopa

EVE: I'm never quite sure if it sounds fun or like a complete catastrophe.

Matso
Matso

@Lateris @Styopa Grats! i remember the first time i went in , was exciting , turned out to be expensive too xD

Matso
Matso

@Lateris @Styopa well then you might like to hear that they revamped the probing system a while ago.

Kaiser Sosey
Kaiser Sosey

Monocle Gate 2.0!  They haven't learned. Truly jumped the shark and are now officially P2W if they weren't already. CCP had all the potential in the world and just pissed it all away. They have finally told the player base what they have wanted to all along, which is to go to hell we'll do whatever we want. It doesn't matter how much you've put into our game.


Truly astounding level of arrogance that I think can only be matched by Derek Smart minus the wads of cash...

LordSolarMacharius
LordSolarMacharius

@Kaiser Sosey Even Derek Smart isn't this arrogant. At least he will back down when he knows for certain he's wrong (most of the time).

Lateris
Lateris

It is leading to the Unreal Engine 4 conversion.  (Kidding)   Listed below are some facts. For example i Had 50,00 skill points I could apply. I was able to bring my 31 days of training down to 13 for a skill. I can see how useful this can be but...I still have to make ISK to purchase the BC I want which is very expensive. It cuts into the time it takes to level a skill book. You could still be dumb arse and have no idea what you are doing and lose it all in a few seconds with game play. 


https://youtu.be/V-Dzn0oH1s8



Matso
Matso

@Lateris Why , all those trillions some are sitting on are being injected back into the market. plus amongst players it as always been a issue that new players need waaay to much time to get up to a similar level as long time players which did make new players often stop playing even after months of investing in the game.


Now they have a future option knowing that they can shorten it and a new motivation to make extra ISK to do so.

DrAtrz
DrAtrz

@Lateris That would be the point now wouldn't it? That new player is not going to be helped unless he dropped a few hundred in real money to boost himself up -OR- he plays the game for several months like he would have anyway grinding the old fashion way to slowly start being able to afford the injectors at their current price. It is quite literally play-to-[try-and-]win for new players, but for us vets we just need to dump our isk to speed train our perfect alts.



This whole thing has never truly been for the new players, it's always been to get more money out of the player base to help fund other projects. Think about this, were people asking for a way to trade skillpoints before they announced these? Or were they asking for a way to reallocate them?

Lateris
Lateris

But as a community member of Eve I do feel it cheapens the experience. 

Thornz
Thornz

Good for that person to have that much extra cash.

karmark678
karmark678

My definition of pay to win ( and I know it differs from person to person ) is being able to spend real money  to give yourself significant advantages over other players in a game where there is a heavy focus on world pvp . 


This to me makes EVE a pay to win game but I guess its subjective so I am sure to many of you it doesn't .

Ket_Viliano
Ket_Viliano

@karmark678  Do you play the game much?

Paying real money, to buy PLEX, to sell for ISK, to buy a ship, that gets ganked on undock, is not pay to win, it's pay to lose!

Most of EVE PvP is done in T2 Cruisers, Pirate Frigs, or BCs, with the occasional T3 Dessie or Cruiser thrown in for lulz. The toon skills to fly those can be had in 2-3 years, 35-55 mil skill points or so. It's best if you focus on one race and it's weapons, at least to start with. So, the 'jectors really only get you a little head start, at the cost of more money instead of less money and more time.


EvE is more about really owning your specialty as a player, much more so than as a toon, and rolling with a tight gang.

exeeter
exeeter

There is only so much you can do in a given ship at one time.

This just means he can technically fulfill any role in the game assuming he can afford the fits and actual knows how to perform said roles with efficiency.

As extreme as this is it's still not p2w

Armsbend
Armsbend

@exeeter afford the fits?  He just paid $28,000 for a character.  I'm going to get out on a limb here and say buying all the PLEX he wants for any ship in the game is a nothing event for him.


saying this game isn't pay to win is as fucking ridiculous as still playing this game is.

Ket_Viliano
Ket_Viliano

@Armsbend @exeeter  Getting killed while flying expensive ships just gets you lolled at in the Kill Mails. Oh, and the forums. You really don't want a reputation as an easy kill if you have any sense of PvPride.

exeeter
exeeter

Obviously he can afford the fits, I was just being clear and specific.

Circumventing a time gate or grind is not pay 2 win no matter how shitty they implement the feature.

The player in this article fitted to a T on a frigate would be no more effective than a player who has only invested in specializing in piloting frigates and has all the necessary skills to pilot any and fit them accordingly.

There is literally ZERO things in eve that are exclusively obtained via real cash that provide any type of statistical advantage above what can be obtain via in game methods. The fact that paying for shortcuts might not sit well with you and rightfully so it can be shitty, but that doesn't change the definition of what p2w actually means.

Yes this feature as well as the character bazaar cheapens the acheivments for those that have devoted in game time to training skills but ultimately, p2w has a single definition of what it entails, and eve contains none of that.

TimothyTierless
TimothyTierless

Man "playing a game" sure has changed...for some reason I have the same feeling I had when Burning Crusade came out and within minutes the character I earned was worth less than some newb that killed his first few BC mobs and got a couple greens. 

quixadhal
quixadhal

I haven't played EVE in years, but one of the things that made it stand out back in the day, was the fact that it didn't take very long for a new player to "catch up" to the skills of a veteran, in a few very narrow areas.


In other words, a veteran would have more skills, and be more rounded... but if you specialized, you could become just as good as them in few things, very quickly.  This made the real time skill training seem fair, since most players do specialize in a handful of core skills and then add more to be able to have more flexible ship builds.


This change just makes it a pure pay-to-win game, since those who can fork over can have fully maxed skills (a thing that wasn't even possible without developer intervention before), which in turn means they will win against most people who can't afford to do this.  A new player can now pull equal with them in those narrow fields, but with fully maxed skills, the twink can set up builds that are really difficult for a specialist to counter, since the counters would require skills from multiple branches.


Silverlock
Silverlock

I wonder if this will discourage or encourage new players. Before potential new players might say there's no way I can catch up to other players so why bother. Now they might say hey if I throw enough cash at it I can be a top player (I'm not saying they can really be top players just that they might tell themselves that).


Years ago I played Eve's two week free trial and I enjoyed it, not enough to subscribe but still. If you're not all wrapped up in what others a doing and just play your own game it can be fun even from the start. 

Sythalin
Sythalin

According to EVE players this system isn't P2W.  $$$ spent means nothing according to just about every defensive post.  So I ask you this:

If $$$ doesn't have any bearing in EVE, why does every single article relate everything to $$$?

Silverlock
Silverlock

@Sythalin Because with Eve they can make a direct correlation to it and nothing gets people's attention like big wads of cash.

MChrome
MChrome

@Sythalin I think the split is 50/50 atm. By no means do the majority thing that this is a good development.

Damonvile
Damonvile

@Sythalin Probably because these events have more to do with CCP trying to break into whale farming and squeezing every last drop of blood from it's tired old stone and less to do with anyone actually winning in eve.


It's not like any of these people are going to single handedly take over the universe now that they've spent so much on skills. They'll be lucky if they can change the outcome of a single small skirmish. 

quark1020
quark1020

@Damonvile @Sythalin Definitely this! All these skill points and skills don't all combine to make a player a demigod within the game. It just means this player spent a lot of money or isk to gain some temporary infamy and a tidy profit for CCP.

Armsbend
Armsbend

@Sythalin In order to truly hate yourself, as every serious Eve player does, you must rationalize your self-hatred.  I'm not joking.

Nyphur
Nyphur moderator

@Sythalin I think I actually may have started the trend of comparing everything to dollars years ago back on massively-that-was, I recall it being after someone released a chart showing the real cash value of ships using PLEX conversion. I started using it in articles on big kills and scams to make the values more relatable to non-players and the other sites always latched onto the headlines that used dollar conversions. We got more views from non-EVE players that way, so we kept using them. If I had said 1.7 trillion ISK instead of $28,000 in this article, only the EVE players would have cared and someone would have done the PLEX conversion anyway.

Zennie
Zennie

@Sythalin It's not like EVE players are forcing journalists to add that $$$ sparkle into their posts. Real-life money to ISK conversion is very easy because of PLEX, so unlike in other games , a real life price of a module or a ship can be easily derived from the ingame currency.


This system may or may not be P2W. Character Bazaar is already up and running for several years, so if you really wanted to buy that titan pilot because you though you would be pwnz0ring n00bs in pvp, you could've done it already (and became just another killmail).

MorpayneRADIO
MorpayneRADIO

There's people feeding their kids with RMT in Eve, this is nothing. 

theeknighthood
theeknighthood

I always wondered what the max number of SP currently was, until they add more skills of course :)