Crowfall says its biggest parcels are crazy expensive because they’re meant for guilds

Last month, we included Crowfall among the games discussed in a Massively Overthinking roundtable that focused on MMO monetization running amok. Why? Because Crowfall has one of the spendiest cash shops in the genre, and it’s not even out yet; indeed, one of its palaces is $7000.

That subject is one ArtCraft has addressed today in a new dev blog, which argues that the price is fine because it’s intended for large guilds.

“The price is high because when 100+ players work together to buy something, the total adds up quickly,” J. Todd Coleman and Gordon Walton jointly explain. “That last part is key. These strongholds are WAY, WAY overkill for use by a single player. Much like in real life, purchasing a giant Imperial Palace doesn’t make a lot of sense if you intend to live alone. The purpose of these larger strongholds is to support large player groups. They provide a mechanism to centralize buildings and exist so that guilds, streamer audiences, or even a loose-knit collection of merchants and crafters can work together, pool resources and create social spaces.”

The baseline price for rank 1 parcel for a regular solo player — you know, your starter home — is $15, extending upward to $25 for a rank 3 and up to $45 for a custom rank 3 parcel. While the prices are subject to change by launch, you can still napkin-math it out: Since some of the capital city parcels are built to hold well over a hundred people and parcels at those same rates, buying one outright is priced correspondingly (though not exactly, since the studio wants to incentivize player congregating — there’s a hefty discount for buying in bulk, in other words).

That probably won’t stop your eyes from bugging out from sticker shock, though.

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118 Comments on "Crowfall says its biggest parcels are crazy expensive because they’re meant for guilds"

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Archebius

If Star Citizen has proven anything, it’s that there are people who enjoy throwing money at game development in exchange for fancy things. If you’re building a game, you want to make things for those people. You’d be stupid not to. The return on investment is immense.

So… why all the hate? This is a cosmetic structure. It offers no real in-game benefit, other than bragging rights. They’re not diminishing anyone else’s enjoyment of the game. They’re not offering something that makes the game pay-to-win. Most players will never even see these monstrosities, because they’re locked away in an eternal kingdom.

I don’t want a 7k parcel. But I’m okay with the fact that there are people out there who do, and I’m fine with ACE building something for them. Of all the projects that I’ve kickstarted, this one has had the best communication and the best level-setting for expectations and design choices. If this is as close to scandal as they get, well, by golly, I guess I’ll find some way to forgive them.

Oh, also, they let you break apart your bundles and sell back pieces you didn’t want. I sold off a bunch of extra VIP time and got a pretty healthy amount of credit back, and I backed it at a middle of the road level. Ten high-level backers with some strategizing could easily afford this without dropping another dime.

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MrNastyButler

A 100+ group of players agreeing on how to spend money…governments can’t even agree on budgets and you want gamers to agree how to spend money in large groups? Oh, this is going to be soo wonderful to watch the drama.

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H. D. Harris🏳️‍🌈

Yeah, I’d be definitely concerned if this was the only way to get these, but they’re all craftable in-game so it’s not as big a deal for me.

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H. D. Harris🏳️‍🌈

This section, which was like super small, specifically

Screenshot_20170706-081510.png
miol
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miol

I’m already seeing the guild invite messages on main chat:

“Join our guild now! For only limited time our entry fee is -50%!”

“We provide a cash-back referrer system, if you can make your friends join us, so /w us now!”

“We’re so much cheaper than the other competitive guilds, we’re basically giving memberships for free! Come join us now!”

XD

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zuldar

So everyone in the guild gives real money to one person who makes the purchase? What could possibly go wrong with that?

Estranged
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Estranged

Nothing at all!

lulz

These guys should know better. Really shameful.

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Paragon Lost

Ever notice that in articles like this with a game controversy that there is always that one person who posts all throughout the thread defending it and questioning everyone? Schlag needs to make a meme for that.

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Armsbend

Nothing wrong with being into your own thing old boy. I can always defend someone’s right to rant about!

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Duffy Smalls

Someone’s gotta answer the questions, otherwise you get an echo chamber of reinforcing negativity towards anything that doesn’t match the primary posting group’s status quo. It’s pretty funny how it plays out in every single thread, to say the audience of this site is predictable is an understatement.

Anything Crowdfunding related you’ll get a good portion of the regulars screaming SCAAAAAAAAAAAM or some related version and then a few people answering questions or trying to counter argue the scam people (latter is waste of energy, too many people just enjoy the feeling of righteous anger). I personally really don’t particularly care about the straight up hate mongers, they got their issues and need to voice em, no problem, have fun. The incorrect statements or question seeking folks I’ll answer if I’m in the mood. Usually the mood passes pretty quickly though ;-)

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Armsbend

To be completely fair the people who have been screaming “SCAAAAAAAAAAAAAM” for years? Those people have been roughly 90%+ correct in every single scenario. I used to get yelled down by regular commentators, developers and the writers of blogs on a near constant basis. Now? Hardly ever. They have known for quite some time that I, and a few other logical mystics, were just about 100% correct on just about every hare-brained criticism I ever had on KS.

This is my giant ego saying ‘I told you so’ and being a general asshole – in character of course. But it is still accurate.

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Archebius

I would echo what Duffy says. Additionally, I’m not sure how you figure that “just about 100% correct,” given that most of the prophecies you’ve given us have yet to be settled – one way or the other.

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Duffy Smalls

How many have been actual scams vs. just failures? Failure is an option as part of crowdfunding, hell it’s an option for the normal publisher games. The publishers are failing a lot of us, we don’t want to play the crap their shelling out these days. So for a lot of people it’s worth throwing a couple bucks at an idea and gambling that maybe they can turn it into something. That is the core reality to crowdfunding, hell to business in general. Someone has to front the cost and the traditional avenues are failing a lot of people, so some devs are turning directly to consumers. While it helps gauge interests and minimizes risk to the funding participants, the downside is it rarely provides enough cash flow upfront to cover needs and more cash will be necessary at some point. Folks just refuse to look at the objective reality of the situation and prefer to live in the bubble of their own ego.

If the thought of losing whatever amount of money is thrown at a project is abhorrent to someone, they should not participate in crowdfunding. If someone just likes pointing at failure as some sort of justification to negate crowdfunding I got a dozen successful ones to point at instead. For every success there will be a much greater number of failures, that’s always been true. Failure is always an option.

Estranged
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Estranged

Armsbend, I hear ya. Smelled the stank on this one since their boobalicious KS dev videos.

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Francis Baud

A meme for me! How lovely <3

Estranged
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Estranged

lulz

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Ashfyn Ninegold

OH, the drama! Crowfall has definitely replaced AA as the game I wouldn’t touch if you paid me but that has/will give me hours of entertainment from the sidelines.

Where is my popcorn?

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Paragon Lost

Big difference at least in my opinion is that Crowfall is telling you about it beforehand. Whereas with AA it was the ongoing meme from Star Wars with Darth and Lando where you hoped the deal wouldn’t get just a bit less appealing every other week. I’ll agree though it’s popcorn worthy. Such things always are.

Solaris
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Solaris

Difference is, in Archeage you pretty much had to shell out cash to keep you land. Crowfall there really is no reason to have land other than for social reasons. All the high end materials needed for crafting have to be found in the game world. All player owned land is Tier I trash. So no, not really like Archeage.

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squidgod2000

So what you’re saying is that I should start a Crowfall guild, pool $7000 from my members, then just disappear.
Because I guarantee that’s going to happen.

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Slaasher

And that’s only one of many possible horrifying scenarios that could go down with this set up.

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Slaasher

Well yeah,…….. no.
I guess I wont support Crowfall. Shame really. I liked some of the places they were going.

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Francis Baud

What’s your issue with people purchasing personal housing’s extravagances at high cost to finance the development of a niche MMO?

Estranged
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Estranged

Their rival game is doing fine without $7000 housing.

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Francis Baud

Camelot Unchained is in a different situation, different payment model, different type of funding, different audience, different marketing approach, etc. etc.

Apples and oranges.

Estranged
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Estranged

Francis – yeah. I wasn’t going to name names, cause most of these people are friends.

You are right, different mentalities, all together.

CU wouldn’t ever set their players up for a $7000 guild scandal.

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Francis Baud

Agreed. On the other hand, ACE is paying all the people working on Crowfall a fair wage afaik, whether it’s professional translators, community managers, content creators, developers, etc. They need money to pay for those people. Other studios (including CSE) use unpaid volunteers to fill certain positions. It’s not “good” or “bad” I guess, it’s just different approaches.

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Francis Baud

Hehe.

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Armsbend

Red Delicious to Granny Smith.

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mcsleaz

I’m in the same boat, was hyped for it till I just saw a $7000 cash shop item for a game that isn’t even released. These clowns must be hanging out with that retard Garriot. Imma tell everyone I know to steer very far from Crowfall.

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Francis Baud

Do you have any suggestions on how they could find the money to pay their developers’ salaries, if not selling overpriced cash shop items that have low impact on gameplay / competitiveness?

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Iain B

Uhh, how do you think any other business works?

For some reason it’s ok for game developers to get away with constantly begging their consumers for money before they actually provide a product.

Name one other industry where the consumers have to keep paying and paying for a product that may, or may not, ever materialize.

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Francis Baud

I’m not “ok” with it. I think it’s an abusive behavior, it’s like exploiting the weaknesses of people (those who are the most addicted and prone to throw impulsively a lot of money to purchase virtual items).

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Armsbend

I do. Finish the game and then sell it. It has worked in the 5000 years of civilization so I assume it will work here.

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Francis Baud

Developers receive a salary to create games.

In order to finish a game, a studio needs developers.

My question was: Do you have any suggestions on how they could find the money to pay their developers’ salaries, if not selling overpriced cash shop items that have low impact on gameplay / competitiveness?

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Armsbend

Use the money you (literally you) made on kickstarter/cashshop/other bullshit to finish your game. If you overestimated how much it would cost to finish the game and you cannot make payroll? Fold up your shop and disappear from existence forever. Claiming you need $7000 housing or everything disappears is the type of hostage bullshit backers should be up in arms about. The developers are making backers feel guilty for not giving enough. Open your wallets or what we have made – is gone.

If that is their attitude; and it is – then FUCK. THEM.

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Utakata

@ Armsbend

Kinda makes me wonder what will happen when the 100 + are caught up in member endorsed exploits. Getting one’s guild banhmmered from a game is one thing. Getting one’s guild banhammered with $7k dumped into “digital property” is likely another. And could make for some interesting legal and/or PR battles. o.O

Estranged
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Estranged

Mana – I’ll be my usual brash self…

This will result in many of a clusterfuck.

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Francis Baud

“If you overestimated how much it would cost to finish the game and you cannot make payroll? Fold up your shop and disappear from existence forever.”

If they do that, not only a great and innovative project (according to me) would not see the light of the day, but those who spent so much time and money supporting it would be very disappointed. The backers pledged millions of dollars to support Crowfall development.

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Armsbend

With every fiber of my being (video game wise [the rest is reserved])I want them to be sad. Whatever scenario brings about the death of crowdfunding – and the return of solid development – is something I can get 100% behind.

The world will most assuredly keep spinning without Crowfall in it’s midst. The gnashing of teeth would last a month at best. The drama would be less than No Man’s Sky on the blip of everlasting game development.

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Francis Baud

Nothing is black or white. Crowdfunding brings lot of crappy stuff, abuses, sub-par quality titles, etc. But there are also upsides. Innovation, for example. Look at Camelot Unchained, Dual Universe, Star Citizen, CF… They’re taking risk and doing things differently than AAA titles. Not just copying a successful MMORPG and adding X or Y to it. Project Gorgon is another example. How could this kind of crazy project ever exists without crowdfunding. No publisher would ever fund this imo. I don’t know if any of the current crowdfunded MMORPGs will release one day, or if they’ll find a big enough niche to be financially viable once they do. We’ll see. One thing for sure is that trying is the only way to know. The founders of many of those studios went all in to make their vision a reality. All in, like, if it fails, they’re screwed big time.

Estranged
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Estranged

Francis, Gorgon isn’t asking for enough to provide 3500 homeless shelter meals for virtual housing.

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Francis Baud

From Project: Gorgon Kickstarter page:

“Pledge $7,500 or more

In addition to all the rewards above, you can choose to revive one of the skill sets that was cut from launch: Were-Tiger, Demonologist, Psi Dominator, or Dark Geologist. […]”

Estranged
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Estranged

Francis – yes. However, I don’t see them promoting it heavily and begging.

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Francis Baud

Project: Gorgon went through at least 3 Kickstarter and one IndieGogo campaigns. They’re selling +$1,000 items in their store.

It takes a lot of money to develop a video game, more for a MMO, and even more for a quality MMO. Some studios have a lot of money at hand, whether because the founders are rich, or because they’re acquainted with some wealthy investors who take the risk to fund their project, or for other reasons. While other studios have to work harder to earn money.

If you consider that selling over-priced items that have low impact on gameplay / competitiveness is shameful, then I’m sure the devs would be happy to hear about your suggestions to get additional money to pay for the bills / salaries.

Estranged
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Estranged

Raise funding based on their experience as developers with reasonable tiers, avoiding whaling expeditions. There are other games doing such.

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Francis Baud

Can you explain how exactly they could raise funding based on their experience as developers with reasonable tiers?

Estranged
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Estranged

Francis, the devs of this project are golden boys. When those types ask for money, it is given.

By the way, read the fine print on the KickStarter. They reserve the right to go with a publisher.

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Francis Baud

Yea, if they’ve got to choose between watching the whole project die due to a lack of funding or going with a publisher, I hope they pick the reasonable option.

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Slaasher

Agreed. I’ve played a lot of really successful games over the years that didn’t require people to drop $7K on a guild house. They are welcome to try and I am welcome to not take part and voice my objection to it. If I don’t then how will they know how many of us feel (this last part is directed at Francis Baud not you Armsbend).

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Francis Baud

Where did the money to fund the development of those games come from? I’m sure indie studios like ACE would be really happy to receive this kind of financial support, unless of course the money came from big publishers that tend to grab all creative control over the game.

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Slaasher

Where does the money come from to start any business venture? Investors, banks, grants, etc. LOL games have been built for years by companies that didn’t use kickstarters or charge potential customers extraordinary sums of money to develop their game.That is a relatively new tactic in gaming development.
From the tone of your responses it sounds like you believe this is the only way for these companies to get started.
It isnt. And IMO it is starting to go too far. The backlash has only just begun. Wait for it.

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Francis Baud

Traditionally the biggest chunk of the money (very often, all of it) came from the publishers.

ACE decided to not go with a publisher, for different reasons (retaining creative control is one of them). So they’ve got to find the money elsewhere. I doubt that banks would lend millions of dollars for such risky endeavor. Investors, ACE have some, but it’s apparently still not enough.

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Reht

And here i was thinking that they were meant for whales…

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Nater

Whelp… sounds like I won’t be playing Crowfall.

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Francis Baud

Why?

Siphaed
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Siphaed

Ridiculous justification for over priced cash shop items on a SUBSCRIPTION based game. It is kind of funny how a game like GUILD WARS 2 can have gigantic guild halls with tons of placable items included it in the boxed copy of the new expansion, which also included the old game…..so basically an all-in-one WITHOUT SUBSCRIPTION. Yet a game that is trying to justify it’s subscription is also nickle-and-dime their customers at every turn.

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Francis Baud

Actually, Crowfall is Buy-to-play and the game was sold at $30 during KS.

We paid $30, we can play forever. Pretty good deal imo.

Siphaed
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Siphaed

Their VIP program sure sounds like a subscription…

https://crowfall.com/en/faq/pricing/#4

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Francis Baud

Subscription-based MMORPGs require players to pay a certain amount of money every month or year in order to play the game (i.e. if you stop paying, you lose access). In Crowfall, you pay for the box and it gives you access to the game and all its content, for as long as the studio keeps its servers open. VIP tokens are entirely optional.

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Duffy Smalls

There’s no sub

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Bhima Jenkins

While true, GW2 has quite a bit of value for very little actual money… Anet is also having a bit of financial troubles themselves and that can be directed at their extremely uninspired cash shop. Even if you play the game currently, its hard to spend extra money in that shop except just as a favor to keep the game you play running.

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Utakata

In WoW for $14.99 USD/month you can create a 100 + person guild for no extra cost as long as you have the ingame gold to establish it. Just saying.

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Francis Baud

In Crowfall it’s even cheaper: you don’t even need to pay for the $14,99USD/month!

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Utakata

I think you’re stretching that goal post for the term “cheaper” there. /alternative facts

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Francis Baud

I’m curious to know why you perceive my post (which points out that you don’t need to pay a sub in CF, nor to pay to create a guild) as an “alternative fact”.

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Utakata

Because you failed to address how $7,000 USD is cheaper than $14.99/month when registering a *guild hall for a 100 + players. Which is BTW the topic of contention for this article. Instead, you went straight for the strawman and erroneously claimed I was comparing WoW sub to Crowfalls entry fees for the /upvote. A very poorly thought out troll move I’ll add. But I suspect you didn’t need that explained. :)

*Note: For clarification, WoW doesn’t have guild halls at this time. If they did however, I doubt they would be charging extra USD for it, even for the large guilds, outside of ingame gold. Therefor, Artcraft’s the asking price for this is inexcusable, IMO.

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Francis Baud

1) The $7,000 building is not a guild hall.

2) The guild hall was sold for $100 and is included in certain pledge packages.

3) A guild hall is not required to create a guild.

4) Any player who buys the box ($30-50) can create a guild in Crowfall.

5) It’s indeed cheaper to have a guild in Crowfall (the price of the box: $30-50) than in WoW ($50 + $180+ / year).

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Utakata

Whatever they’re calling it, and getting back to my point, Blizz would unlikely charge anything for it, let alone $7000, if this guild mechanic was ever implemented in WoW. My argument still remains. /shrug

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Francis Baud

Blizzard gets $180 per player per year. There are millions of subscribers. Now compare it with Crowfall, and you’ll likely understand how it’s a different situation and why they’re selling overpriced pixels.

camren_rooke
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camren_rooke

While I understand the need to innovate and make new and interesting gameplay, some part of me still longs for the days of Electronics Boutique and Wizardy: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord.

/e totters off to play Minesweeper.

At least it doesn’t have dailies and monetizati…..DAMMIT!

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Witches

Yet, unlike a real guild that requires a minimum number of players to create, i bet it only takes one player to buy one of these.

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Arktouros

Honestly this has always been one of the biggest source of skepticism I have towards Crowfall more than anything else. I find it really hard to believe a company is selling anything for $7000 without some sort of in game advantage. As someone who actually does spend a bit on games things like this just put me off entirely.

miol
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miol

Just like with Chronicles of Elyria!

I was so excited about their concept of “subbing per avatar life” and the level of detail for its world mechanics, but then you suddenly hear about their aristocracy premiums! Wth! :/

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Melissa McDonald

In Second Life when you buy a parcel you have complete ownership rights and controls over it, only the Linden Labs developers can supersede it. You can set damage on/off, add people, ban people, create boundaries and sub-parcels, a litany of ownership rights. You can lease or rent parcels and make income from those who rent/lease. Does Crowfall offer the same?

in SL an entire Region (65,536 sqm) is $195/month. That’s the equivalent of 3 years of ownership against this game’s pricing. I am guessing that’s a much larger plot, too than you get in Crowfall.

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Pauleh

Unless you have a grandfathered sim, it’s $295 a month.

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Melissa McDonald

Mainland regions are $195, private are $295. Private regions are practically your own game and server.

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Duffy Smalls

The parcels and buildings you can buy for cash are for use in their Eternal Kingdoms, what boils down to their version of instanced housing. They cannot be used in the actual Campaign Worlds where players fight. Yes the owners can control a bunch of permissions to what can and cannot be done within one of these EKs.

miol
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miol

But don’t EKs give you an economic/crafting advantage for the Campaign Worlds? As a headstart or as an additional supply line?

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Duffy Smalls

The EKs only have ‘basic’ resources that don’t confer stat bonuses, good enough for literally your starter set of what would normally be considered grey gear in your WoW quality color scheme. Those basic resources that are plentiful and have minimal value in the Campaigns as they aren’t used in the crafting of ‘real’ gear.

The real resource advantage comes from exporting resources from a campaign you won (or lost, export limits depend on the rule-set) and then importing them back into a different campaign to get a bit of a leg up. The EK is the middle man in that process and you can do some crafting/trading at that step. It’s unclear if there will be any real advantage to crafting in your EK aside from it being a convenient accumulation point for your guilds resource ‘winnings’ and cross EK trading. Right now I’m leaning towards crafting gear in the EK for import being a very inefficient way to benefit from your spoils, but we need more info on the limits and details of the Import/Export system.

There are some trophies/relics that you can win or acquire that give some small buffs and can be placed in your EK, but it’s unclear how those will work with the Campaigns if at all. There is also some talk of slotting Thralls in various buildings but again you need to acquire them from the Campaign Worlds and export them back to your EK.

So about the only thing buying EK stuff does for you is provide slots for your eventual ‘winnings’ to go in or let you do some crafting before you import to the next campaign. You can also just craft EK parcels and buildings from the raw resources you collect in the Campaigns (this might be the only realllly beneficial crafting in EKs). The theory is that it won’t be very hard to get enough parcels/buildings for a usable setup, but making it ‘cool’ and ‘pretty’ will require a lot of work/resources or using the cash shop.

miol
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miol

Thank you for clarifying!

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Paragon Lost

So, is real life money the only way to purchase these? If so, yeah I have a problem with it. If you have the option to raise in game coinage to pay for items then I have no issues.

Edit: I say this as a whale player who can afford to pay real life cash for items and frequently do. That said the whole cash shop system is one that I’m not fond of and I’ve listed why many times over the past few years.

Solaris
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Solaris

No. You can craft land parcels. (Largest possible parcel has already been crafted in Alpha). Same with the buildings.

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Francis Baud

Everything that is sold in the cash shop so far, except the tax-free parcels and VIP tokens, can be obtained in-game by playing the game normally afaik. Could a single player get enough resources in-game to build a $7,000 castle in a reasonable time frame? I guess not. Maybe a big guild could achieve it, we’ll see down the road.

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Melissa McDonald

Put it in perspective, though, that’s just a few ships in Star Citizen.

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Bhima Jenkins

Don’t think SC is charging for anything else but ships and ship upgrades though if I’m not mistaken. No sub for SC.

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Paragon Lost

My question still stands. Will they be able to earn coinage “in game” so that they can buy these buildings in game. Same applies to SC or any other mmo.

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Francis Baud

The buildings sold in the cash shop can be obtained in-game through normal gameplay. Players can collect materials and build structures both in the Eternal Kingdoms (PvE/social) and the Campaign Worlds (PvP). How long it will take to gather enough resources to build those castles: we don’t know yet. I guess small ones will not take too long to build, while the biggest ones may require the effort of dozens of players and months of work.

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Duffy Smalls

You can craft them directly from resources acquired in game, so more or less yes.

Estranged
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Estranged

Duffy, $7000 worth of parcels would have to be years upon years of grinding to keep Whales happy.

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Paragon Lost

Hey, leave me out of this! I’m a happy, grinding whale. ;>

Estranged
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Estranged

Lost – Oh hell no, you would spend 7K on a motorcycle.

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Paragon Lost

lol! That’s true, a lot more than that actually. :) I do “at times” when crap is in game shops spend more than I should though. I’m against the concept because it brings out the worst in game design mechanics. Matter of principle for me.

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Francis Baud

Yea, if one person decided to go alone and collect the materials required to build the $7K citadel, it would likely take forever. If it’s a 60-players guild, it’s probably attainable in a reasonable time frame.

Estranged
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Estranged

Francis, no freaking way. The whales would riot.

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Francis Baud

No, don’t worry about our Development Partners (that’s how they’re called!). They know Crowfall is a very risky journey. They were warned.

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Duffy Smalls

Maybe, or some of the specific styles might just not be available to craft, ala ‘unique’ skins basically. I think they are leaning toward the latter.

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Paragon Lost

Good deal. In my opinion systems that don’t support “in game” mechanics and rely on out of game currency tend to be less enjoyable for all involved.

camren_rooke
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camren_rooke

From the discussion it sounds like there is an option to craft them but its not clearly spelled out.

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BalsBigBrother

Yeah because guild drama isn’t already bad enough without having parted with monies towards a $7000 plot of pixel for said guild /sigh

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Targeter

“You kicked me out?! Well, I want a refund on the money I gave you for our castle!”

This will happen many, many times.

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Francis Baud

“Allies. Enemies. Empires. Betrayal. Risk. Conquest.”

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BalsBigBrother

Oh my mistake that makes it all better, please move on nothing to see here /sarcasm

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Francis Baud

Players enter the world of Crowfall knowing (at least if they’ve read the first paragraphs of the In-Game Rules of Conduct) that “the elements below are allowed in-game, so long as the context is within the in-game conflict:

ridicule, mock, taunt, stalk, threaten, harass, betray, scam, intimidate or abuse“.

So yes, this kind of things you mention will likely happen. Whether it’s good or bad, you decide, but at least players are warned beforehand and those who do not want to take part in this kind of harsh in-game “political plays” are advised to move to a more civilized MMORPG.

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Francis Baud

I wonder how something written in the first 2 paragraphs of the Rules of Conduct could reasonably be considered “fine print”.

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BalsBigBrother

Please refer to my comment above *shakes head and walks away*

/sigh

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Armsbend

“Yes, I stole his Horse of Power. I paid $100 for the castle and he didn’t. Kick HIM out.”

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kanbe

That’s brings up what I really wonder about this, who owns the castle? I do but there are equal rights among the contributors.

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cista2bpo

This is an interesting novelty though, because when they say players must “work together to buy something”, they don’t actually mean players as much as *people*, people coordinating their worklife efforts IRL, sending each other real amounts of money to combine to this large sum of 7,000 USD that they can finally send to this big company that wants their money.
This has nothing to do with a videogame actually.

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Francis Baud

Or they could just literally “work together to buy something” in-game, since all those structures are obtainable by just playing the game normally.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

people thought the adoption in the west of cash shops and lockboxes was bad. but kickstarter has vastly surpassed the predation involved with this genre’s monetization schemes. wether it’s crowfall or sota or star citizen.

no matter how these companies and their fans rationalize it, it’s all shit that is a scary thought should schemes like these be adopted in wider way in the industry.

imagine an ea or activision published title with all the same rhetoric these kickstarter devs bring to bear with hundreds and thousands dollar priced microtransactions for sale years ahead of a delivered product. that’s the future these schemes promise.

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Bhima Jenkins

At least EA et. al. actually releases finished games. Many of the kickstarter games do not.

While I don’t condone fleecing gamers, we gamers have literally only ourselves to blame if we continue to pour money into a game that doesn’t even exist yet.

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Veldan

There’s plenty of succesful kickstarter releases. Yes it’s true that it’s possible to fund a bad project and waste money, but it’s also possible to purchase a bad released game and waste money. In the end it’s just Sturgeon’s Law applying to kickstarter games as much as to anything else. It’s up to you to do your research and back the right projects. I personally don’t have any regrets about the things I backed, they’re all looking great and shaping up to be fantastic games.

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Duffy Smalls

Here’s the thing, I don’t want to play any of the games the ‘real’ companies are making so the fact that they ‘release’ doesn’t matter in the slightest. The crowd funding guys are the only ones trying to make some of the kinds of games I want to play so I throw some money at them. If you know the risks and can afford potentially throwing some money away it’s worth it to a lot of people. If not well, don’t participate then that’s perfectly fine.

I personally can’t stand the whole ‘omg it’s a scam’ blah blah blah false indignation comments. Of course some will fail, it’s laid out in the damn premise. That said it’s not hard to avoid the really sketchy ones, I’ve had only 1.5 KS fail of about a dozen on me. Sure some were late, but they still delivered. People need to get over their bullshit and just learn to deal with the reality or ignore it if they don’t like it.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

all i can say is consumer protection laws do not exist on the think that we only have ourselves to blame priniciple. i’m not even going to go into the vaguely relevant to some people fraud laws out there.

kickstarter and crowdfunding literally flouts these laws and it’s only a matter of time until there’s a crack down.

wpDiscuz