Fallout 76 may be flipping on its no-lockboxes vow

    
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With only days to go until New Year’s Eve, Bethesda has to redouble its efforts to run Fallout 76 right into the ground. So how will the studio earn that “Most Disappointing Game of the Year” award from major games outlets? How about introducing lockboxes into a game that it specifically said it would keep free of such items?

Yes, this may well be true. Players combing through the changelogs for upcoming patches have found references to Atom Store “lunch boxes” that open up with visual flair and contain items that include party favors, gift bags, bonuses, and items that cancel out negative effects. It’s possible these are some sort of holiday gift, but Fallout Shelter players know lunch boxes quite well, as those are the lockboxes that already permeate that free-to-play game.

Back in October, Pete Hines said of the game’s monetization system that, “We give you a s**tload of Atoms just for playing the game. Folks that want to spend money on whatever the hell it is because they don’t have enough Atoms, they can, but it’s not, ‘I’m now better playing against other players because I spent money.’ It’s not pay-to-win. And it’s not loot crates.”

Source: PCGamer, VG247
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Utakata

There seems to be a lot of falling out with Fallout these days… o.O

Mewmew
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Mewmew

I hate to assume anything. It’s okay to worry and let Bethesda know we don’t want this stuff, but let’s not say we absolutely know what is coming, because these are just guesses.

The game does feel like it was meant to sell Perk Cards randomly in packs, and then they just decided to take that out of the game in the end and give them out as rewards every 5 levels instead. *Maybe* something like that is going to happen with these other “lunch boxes” as well, so let’s not assume we know they’re going to be sold.

*Edit – The reddit post this all comes from says “Lunchboxes. They look like holiday gifts for now. (Even though they look like part of the holidays special, we included them, so you can see what is been worked on them.)”

So the original post says they look like Holiday Gifts, it’s the game sites that went with the story that they may be selling lockboxes.

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BalsBigBrother

+1 for actually not taking it at face value or and actually looking into it a little bit

*looks accusingly at 99% of the other comments*

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DargorV .

Oh wow, its like they’re trying their hardest to suck…

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Matt Comstock

Always a delicate issue. I’m not directly familiar with how lunch boxes operated in previous Fallout entries. But IF they are introduced here, it does seem Bethesda would be doing some backpedaling. If it is mainly food/thirst benefits I don’t see the problem. But IF they step into providing weapons/armor, damage/defense bonuses, and/or experience bonuses I think they are crossing the line into P2W, despite the ability to earn atoms in-game. However, I will hold my judgment until I see how these lunchboxes are implemented.

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Sorenthaz

Folks started creating a big scare over it when we still don’t know how it will be implemented. Supposedly it could be part of a winter event, in which case that isn’t so bad. I could also see it being a form of in-game compensation akin to what BDO does. Either way, nothing to be outraged about quite yet, even though I know folks are hungry for more drama out of this game. Here’s the original context.

((Edited by mod to turn massive embed into a link instead.))

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Nathan Aldana

“its not loot crates (its lunchboxes)

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Utakata

…and I have a dead parrot that’s just “resting” to sell you! O.o

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Roger Melly

I suppose the way Bethesda will view it calling Lockboxes something else will keep their promise to not introduce them into the game but of course a lunchbox is probably a lockbox in all but name .

camren_rooke
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camren_rooke

Like Chapters versus DLC?

/e gives ESO the side eye.

Vaeris
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Vaeris

So it’s not a “lockbox” because they aren’t “guiding” you to buy a key to open it kind of thing.

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Axetwin .

It’s funny he mentions that it’s not “I’m now better playing against other players because I spent money” because the rumor is Bethesda is also supposed to be adding power up items to the cash shop as well.

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rafael12104

Wait, wait, wait… We are assuming these are lock boxes when they could just as easily be seasonal rewards. I will withhold judgment until that is known.

camren_rooke
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camren_rooke

Agreed but given the way the triple AAA game industry is going, thinking the worst of a company seems to be the winning(?) bet.

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rafael12104

Yeah. I can’t dispute that. I have a really bad vibe from the industry as a whole. Heh. I don’t think I’ve used the word “vibe” in years.

But, holding on to hope that this is not another blunder. Too much to ask for? LOL! Maybe, maybe…

camren_rooke
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camren_rooke

It’s ok.
Hippies are still a thing.
You can use ‘vibe’

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rafael12104

Are squares still a thing? I think I am one.

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Nathan Aldana

do you really think theyre gonna call it the exact same thing as Shelter’s lootboxes just to be holiday gift bags.

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rafael12104

Maybe. The point is, we don’t know yet. No need to get worked up over it, yet.

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Greaterdivinity

Didn’t they say no “loot” boxes, not no “lock” boxes? https://www.kitguru.net/gaming/damien-cox/bethesda-forgoes-loot-boxes-in-fallout-76-reiterating-that-microtransactions-arent-pay-to-win/

Because this seems more like lockboxes rather than loot boxes, the buffs are apparently similar to buffs you get from chems etc. in-game and there doesn’t appear to be anything other than that stuff and cosmetics so far. Shitty, but lock boxes should have been expected given the state of the industry.

The bigger issue now seems their pricing overall, and that’s partially a result of the free ATOMS they hand out. Things are seemingly ludicrously overpriced if you were to purchase them alone ($20+ for an outfit >.>), but when you factor in the free ATOMS folks are earning then pricing becomes a lot more “reasonable”. They’re going to need to get a handle on the messaging around their cash shop and pricing, because right now the majority of their communications are purely reactive (“We’ll pass the feedback along”) and they’re doing nothing to really even attempt to steer the narrative with the community : /

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McGuffn

This is as good a place as any to say that i really hate the term lootbox. Stick with lockboxes or something newer like gambleboxes or poopcrates.

Loot is something you get by actually playing the game. Don’t stigmatize it by association with their crappy pay-to-gamble mechanic. And the companies have an incentive to change the name because it will get more people to buy their garbage.

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camren_rooke

Poopcrates really is the best term. Most of the stuff in ESO’s are purely poop.

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Bree Royce

“Lootboxes” and “lootcrates” actively infuriate me. It was a willful attempt at language manipulation by publishers. Gross. We try to stick with lockboxes and gambleboxes and only include the “loot” spinoffs for clarity/SEO/tags/etc.

Poopcrates is A+

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BalsBigBrother

Why is the pricing an issue in Fallout 76 and not say Path of Exile who recently highlighted an outfit that would cost $130 in total and you can’t get it for free in PoE either. You can earn atoms by playing in F76 to feasibly buy anything on the atom store without spending any more than the initial box price.

Does the box price make that much of a difference to peoples perceptions? I mean I have spent more in a single lock box buying spree in PoE than the box price of F76 (prediscount too). The only real difference in practical terms is when I made the payments to each of the respective games.

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Greaterdivinity

Partially because of the upfront cost vs. PoE being F2P and releasing free vs. paid DLC content. PoE doesn’t have any monetization mechanics outside of cosmetics, Bethesda has box sales and content DLC in addition to their cosmetic sales.

Mind you, I’m not necessarily strongly opposed to their pricing. If you’re gonna sell something, it SHOULD be cosmetics that are optional and can be sold at a premium. And as I don’t know how hard/easy it is to get ATOMS in-game I don’t know how long it would take to earn enough for a purchase or at least to cover the bulk of the costs. But hot damn if I’m not seeing a whole lot of grumbling and discussion about the pricing in the reddit whenever I poke about.

Which PoE outfit are you talking about, though? Is that from one of the supporter packs? Because if so you get a whole lot more than just the outfit. Beyond that, PoE seems to have gotten pretty good at figuring out the pricing for their specific audience (hardcore ARPG players who are happy to drop huge amounts), whereas Bethesda is just feeling out theirs and is going in without having the wind at their backs (to the contrary they’re going head-on into the wind).

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BalsBigBrother

The second option they highlight is $135 worth of cosmetics to achieve the look they are pushing: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2269290

The armour set on its own cost more than the current box price of F76 coming in at $45.00 without all the extras highlighted in the second picture.

With regard to Fallout 76 dlc it was my understanding that would be free and like PoE any future monetisation will come solely from the in game store sales. I can find the quotes if you really want me to.

So again the only difference is the box price for F76. While still being able to earn store currency (reasonably easily as it happens) so you can potentially not have to pay anything else ever.

As opposed to PoE, free initially but the cosmetics are pretty expensive and you may have to pay for some QoL items such as stash tabs depending on your tolerances for items sorting.

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Bullet Teeth

Here’s the major differences between PoE and FO76 (gameplay-wise not withstanding) as have been pointed out already, mostly by observation, and partly by lack of perception and white-knighting.

FO76 is a lazy fucking cash-grabbing phone-in project created with the sole intention of jumping on the “Games as a Service” train. This is without a doubt, probably the worst game I’ve ever had the displeasure of interacting with – because you actually can’t “play” it most of the time, so we’re simply interacting with it – This will be this generations “Superman 64” before long, if not already is. You or anyone else cannot tell me with a straight fucking face that this “game” – again, a game signifies you can actually play it – is REMOTELY worth anything, let alone SIXTY GODDAMN DOLLARS.

Then you have folks on this very site talking about “this is game of the year material”, “best multiplayer game ever”, etc?

C’mon man.

PoE had almost zero funding initially, and was built from scratch by an indie team who still continues to put out solid, FREE content several times a year. With the exception of my Closed Beta buy-in that was 5$, I’ve never HAD to buy anything. And that’s been what….5 years now? I’ve only recently started dropping cash on them because I literally feel guilty after the years of enjoyment I’ve had at zero cost. I have about 7000 unused credits (don’t even know what the hell they’re called because I never use them) just because I felt like giving back. So if I have to spend say 60$ so I can have my Templar look like a WAR Witch Hunter, then I’m in. Because I’ve spent ZERO dollars in 5 years.

I’m supporting a project that’s been managed well, by passionate developers who care. Integrity & principle is worth more than my money. They’re not lying to my fucking face, telling me one thing and trying to sell me another.

And let’s be honest, PoE is pretty much THE reason D3 sank in popularity.

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BalsBigBrother

I play and spend a lot of money on PoE have multiple supporter packs. Even so I recognise the price of their cosmetics is high more than the actual cost of f76 ones as it happens.

When you compare the cash shops they operate in a very similar way in practical terms. Though PoE is more expensive and also has loot boxes (the best in any game in terms of how they operate but still loot boxes) F76 has an option to obtain everything for free while offering cheaper cosmetics and currently no loot boxes.

I am not going to comment on the other stuff you posted as that seems to be smoke screening and distractions (especially your 2nd paragraph) away from the actual topic of cash shop prices.

Just to be totally clear I am not knocking PoE or saying what they are doing is wrong. I wouldn’t have spent the money I have with them if I thought that. However, I am interested in a discussion of other people perceptions of PoE vs F76 cash shop practices.

If you want to discuss that without the other “stuff” I will happily continue otherwise good day and farewell o/

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Bullet Teeth

“I am interested in a discussion of other people perceptions of PoE vs F76 cash shop practices.”

You are, are you?

Well then, the perception is simple:

Fallout 64 is a poorly made, $60 “AAA” “game” where I’ll spend an ADDITIONAL 18 dollars just for the opportunity to paint my Power Armor blue…

Path of Exile is FREE. I’ve spent 0 dollars and .00 cents for 5+ years of content.

Discussion over.
“good day and farewell o/”

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Bullet Teeth

You also argue “So again the only difference is the box price for F76.” which is a pretty fucking huge difference, mate. If PoE sucked moose balls, nobody would give a shit. Because it’s a F2P game! (A F2P game I might add that is the current king of the ARPG genre) The $60 price tag comes with the expectation and confirmation of a completed game. One that’s coherent and playable for more than 8 fucking minutes! A game good enough to make you say to yourself “I like this, I like the time I’m having here. The devs put the work into making my time enjoyable, so I think I’ll invest in a Rocket Suit”.

This particular $60 pricetag bought you a literal shit-heap!

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BalsBigBrother

I have over 48 hours of playing since launch so I think I have managed more than 8 minutes and I guess that would mean I like it.

Dunno though it could be that I am not able to make up my own mind and need to rely on the internet crowd to do it for me.

If you feel differently I am fine with that and accept that others have different opinions on a subjective subject such as liking a game or not. You seem to have difficulty doing the same and can’t look past that to discuss things the matter at hand. /shrugs

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BalsBigBrother

Yet you don’t have to pay an additional $18 to paint your power armour blue you can play the game and earn the credits by doing nothing special other than playing the game.

This is the core issue for me that everyone is neatly avoiding making a comment on and just glossing over. You can pay the entry fee (not $60 btw) and never have to pay anything else ever not for the cosmetics nor for any future content release (that part just like PoE.) This is a literal buy to play game that will give you all future content and cosmetics for no other cost.