New World talks up recently added PvP features, repeats desire to make PvP and PvE gameplay coexist

    
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New World offers both PvP and PvE gameplay, and balancing these two modes is as important to us as it is to many of you,” opens a dev blog shared by the devs at Amazon Games Studio, which then moves in to a synopsis of recently introduced PvP gameplay features and the overall vision for PvP in the game.

First and foremost, the devs once more express a desire to make “PvP and PvE gameplay not only coexist, but complement each other so players can bounce back and forth between focusing on PvP and PvE.” Incidentally, the team is also hoping to ensure that both styles of gameplay are equally rewarding while making PvP meaningful; readers will note this as something of a repeated message.

After that, the post goes into a bit more detail about the current build’s PvP offerings, specifically the addition of capture points in forts this month and the 20v20 Outpost Rush last month. The post then closes with promise of additional PvP gameplay additions post-launch, noting that “launch is just the beginning.”

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Drunk3nShaman

Been in the Alpha for awhile now and every patch is blowing me away with the massive work they are doing on this title. PvE Vs PvP aside (I love both) with 3 months left until Beta the game already feels so much better then it did in January.
NW went from the solid bones of a game to a fleshed out game in less than a year with more to come before launch.

Color me excited.

NW is the best MMO I have played in years.
Combat, Crafting and the world is amazing and everything else is coming into place.

Really look forward to every patch and can’t say that about an MMO since WoW Cataclysm

Only true action combat system there is without floaty combat, that and crafting will keep me around while they get ready for launch and beyond.

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Robert Mann

Oh yay, ANOTHER PvP thing to impact PvE stuff. Instead of being exciting about getting buffs, it becomes a “Well, there go the buffs again, can’t just leave us to our thing.”

The problem here is that PvE players can’t impact this without going to do what they often don’t want… PvP. It’s long been shown that the efforts to pull PvE players into PvP just result in PvE players either lambasting it openly or even quitting a game.

You want the modes to support each other, be switchable, and all that? Then you have to do two things. First, they need to be their own thing. Second, they need to not impact the other directly, but rather through reasons to care about each other.

The first is obvious, given prior history. The second is also obvious, because it’s directly related to the first… but somehow developers still seem to want to ignore it.

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wratts

While I think the game itself is a mixed bag, I’d just point out that the hottest release of the last month was Outriders, a game that deliberately excluded PVP in a looter shooter genre that’s known for including it.

Seems to me what the gaming community tends to reward is novelty or excellence in a specific area, rather than an “everything to everyone” approach. This smells of weak leadership at AGS (shocker) that’s not willing to focus their release on a specific market and drive everything at that focus

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Bruno Brito

Seems to me what the gaming community tends to reward is novelty or excellence in a specific area, rather than an “everything to everyone” approach

Disagree. If this were true, there wouldn’t be enough demand for a PvE mode in Overwatch. Yet, they’re making a second version with PvE CO-OP.

What the gaming community rewards is CONSISTENCY. Hottest releases don’t matter, what matter is if they’re still hot 3/4/5 months later.

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wratts

OW is a five-year old title with a committed playerbase because they already demonstrated excellence as a vey focused arena shooter, they get a lot more leeway at this point

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David Goodman

Under the assumption that AGS doesnt’ cancel this one too, of course. Hmm. No, they’ll probably stick with it even if everything else is gone: They’ve sunk too much into it to be a completely failed studio without anything to show for the time and money.

But I think that this desperation means that they’re going to try to create a game that tries to appeal to everyone, but only succeeds in “Meh’ing” everyone.

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Richard de Leon III

Appealing to everyone is something every game has to do at some point, its all about the profit. If they wanted to make a pvp game, it had to remove any sense of loss in order to attract as many players as possible. Thats the reason Fortnite (and others of its ilk) does so well. PVE players couldnt care less about win/loss stats, just material and time/progression loss from being killed.

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Richard de Leon III

Unless there was a way to completely be immune to pvp, I wouldnt consider any game. I prefer my pvp in an environment where it can be completely balanced and not affect PVE gathering and progression, ie COD and its clones.

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Adam Russell

Well from the sound of the posts you might as well drop pvp altogether because most pvp’ers have already made up their minds against it.

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Strixxx

Not at all.

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Drunk3nShaman

Love the PvP

Raap
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Raap

This doesn’t seem remotely appealing to any PvP MMO players I personally know (myself included). If this was the “big faction update aimed to pull back PvPers”, then I’m not sure if I should laugh or continue not caring.

You get to fight over some flags that give you no personal rewards, and the moment you leave the capture points the enemy faction can fast travel (teleport) nearby to the capture points and flip them again. This simply creates a tedious and unrewarding loop, where there are no real winners, and only losers in the form of players that quit due to attrition factors.

And even if you do put up with this nonsense… You earn a staggering 5% more experience from PvE… Which you’re not benefitting from while doing the PvP legwork. Meanwhile, the people from your faction who contributed nothing to the battle, get all the “benefits”.

AGS seems hell-bent on excluding reward incentives from PvP. Meanwhile, in the very same update, they are adding unique resources you can only obtain from dungeons, making those mandatory to run. Some strange design standards, there.

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Java Jawa

I feel like this has been tried over and over and really, the two play styles don’t mesh. There will always be players that favor one extreme over the other and thus there will always be a large discrepancy between skill balancing.

You almost need a pve and a pvp version of skills, each balanced according to it’s corresponding category.

Than again, SWG got it right 15 years ago . . . .

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Arktouros

I’ve been in PvP communities for the last 20 years and I’ve honestly never heard any PvP player wax nostalgic for SWG’s PvP system. UO, AC, DAoC even a few EQ but never SWG.

I’ve heard lots of PvE players talk about how great it was, though.

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Schmidt.Capela

SWG allowed players to simply and easily opt out of all PvP, so of course those that want other players to be unwilling targets disliked it. Similar to how a lot of PvPers consider the introduction of Trammel, providing UO players an easy way to opt out of PvP, to have ruined UO’s PvP.

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Arktouros

Players haven’t be unwilling since EverQuest launched 21 years ago and gave people who didn’t want to PvP a game/mode without PvP. Anyone else who knowingly chooses to log into an environment with PvP enabled has willingly chosen to do so. This that whole “wolves vs sheep” delusional narrative that’s repeatedly been proven false.

Just like PvP players had the option to choose to play SWG, but most didn’t because the system was bad and unappealing. Instead us PvPers just played other games that were just better. So someone claiming “SWG got it right 15 years ago” is just wrong.

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Richard de Leon III

Just like most things, it was right for a segment of the consumer base. If you want PVE player’s to invest in a game, the pvp has to be completely avoidable and unnecessary, which defeats the purpose of a pvp system. If any system is right, imho, its Crowfall. The game has to be reset frequently to remove all sense of progression so that any loss from being pkilled is rendered moot over the long term.

PlasmaJohn
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PlasmaJohn

PvP (burst) and PvE (sustained) damage profiles are completely orthogonal to one another. Trying to create mixed mode content is doomed to failure from the get go.

Skills must be segregated by mode. While they can share a name and aesthetics they must be functional for the damage profile. PvP is all about player skill. Anybody that tells you that PvP needs power progression is either naive or self-serving.

Mixing PvE objectives in PvP zones is just begging for a hard pass from your PvE players. Requiring PvE objectives (like instanced raids) to be completed for PvP bonuses is going to piss off your PvP players.

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Arktouros

Requiring PvE objectives (like instanced raids) to be completed for PvP bonuses is going to piss off your PvP players.

Generally speaking no. It’s annoying for sure, but the near universal trait I can attribute to PvP players is we’re willing to do whatever content so long as it gives them a competitive advantage in PvP. If that means raiding in super hardcore PvE content or everyone making mining/industrial style characters to fuel the war effort then so be it.

PlasmaJohn
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PlasmaJohn

In my experience there’s just as much wailing and gnashing of teeth when PvP’er’s are required to complete raid content as when story mode PvE players are required to traverse PvP zones. Could just be a case of which part of the community is the loudest.

The better question is: What are the network effects of their dissatisfaction? Do they constitute a enough of a critical mass that would cause a mass exodus?

Even if it’s not the direct cause of somebody leaving irritating your customers is an excellent way of souring the business relationship.

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Arktouros

Fundamentally PvP MMO players are still playing a RPG game to PvP in. We’re not looking for a “Chivalry” or “Mordhau” style game where you do nothing but hop in and do 100% PvP. This has always been a big misunderstanding on PvE players parts in regards to this topic and why they claim PvE elements are added to the game to “lure in” PvE players.

That said often times PvP modes in games are entirely unrewarding. This is because most devs recognize the inherent potential for abuse in making rewards granted by interacting with other players. Like in GW2 you see people all the time just trebbing walls or repairing walls just to keep their score/rewards active. I’ve seen lots of complaining about this topic, as if I’m dedicating 4 hours to defending our land territory and it’s less rewarding than spending 30 minutes in a dungeon then that’s kinda shitty.

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Leiloni

I don’t think they’re mixing PvP and PvE like that in this game. From what I understand PvP and PvE modes are already separate modes but they complement each other. So for example the town board has projects you can use to build up your town which is a PvE thing where players can pick up quests to help complete the projects, and to own the town (and have control over which projects are started) is a PvP thing to gain faction influence via PvP quests/fort and then win the 50v50 War.

PlasmaJohn
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PlasmaJohn

I would hope not but I don’t put anything past developers who think they know better.

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Robert Mann

Which is still going to upset PvE players who want nothing to do with the PvP players who are in that position. The response will be “Then PvP them out.” Except… that’s asking people without the PvP interest or experience to drive out those with it through the other’s specialty.

End result, nonsense.

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Arktouros

As a PvP oriented player this game is still a hard pass for me. Like they don’t even need to go back to the point where it was FFA flagging PvP or you could declare war on any guild and such let alone any kind of loot drop.

However simply put if I can go back to a 2012 era game like GW2 or even later with ESO and log in and get more open world PvP action then your game just isn’t a good PvP game. That’s the minimum bar. Some sort of open world area where you can go PvP and be rewarded for spending your time there like every other game mode.

Capturing forts is okay, but not great. The bigger, what should be obvious, concern based on past games is that stacking boosts for people encourages people to blob up on one faction. People are already inclined to do this in most games but when you reward it by game design it just makes the whole situation a lot worse.