Rockstar: ‘No one has been banned for using GTA single-player mods’

    
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GTA Online

If you’ve been visiting any GTA V or GTA Online forums this week, you’ve surely heard about the modding brouhaha that cropped up with the last patch. If you haven’t heard, well, a significant chunk of fans have convinced themselves that Rockstar is targeting modders for extermination, which would sort of suck since it’s reasonable to assume that most people buying (or re-buying) GTA V on the PC are doing so because of the mod potential.

In any event, Rockstar has finally addressed the controversy via a Q&A session on its website.

“The modding policy in our license has not changed and is the same as for GTA IV. Recent updates to GTA V PC had an unintended effect of making unplayable certain single player modifications,” Rockstar explains. “This was not intentional, no one has been banned for using single player modifications, and you should not worry about being banned or being relegated to the cheater pool just for using single player PC mods.” The company goes on to say that its primary focus is keeping GTA Online free of cheaters and associated mods, and that the use of mods may on occasion “cause instability or affect your game in unforeseen ways.”

[Source: Rockstar newswire]
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Madda
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Madda

dirtyklingon Madda Ah, Madda sees the light now.

You’re still an asshole for changing Madda’s opinion though.

Madda
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Madda

You say that like it will discredit it.

blast tyrant
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blast tyrant

Werewolf Finds Dragon These are the attitudes that we’ve gotten since we’ve been making more realistic games for extroverted players. An extrovert doesn’t have the perspicacity to sit and think that, perhaps, a video game doesn’t equal any kind of achievement, it doesn’t make the person playing it special, and you haven’t really earned anything. You’ve just wasted a bunch of time on a bloody video game. No one is going to remember that you have a certain set of achievements in that video game, no one is going to care.

You usually make some really good points in your posts, but this kind of reductive extrovert/introvert myopia is a discredit to the rest of your argument.  The whole introvert/extrovert divide is not nearly as neat (or frankly, as significant) as you want it to be, and while it might be convenient to throw everything you don’t like about games into the ‘mean old extroverts ruined it’ box that doesn’t make it a fair assessment of the situation.  More to the point, acheivements are in no way incompatible with escapism.  Candidly, if you think the real world rewards you for being the best worker ant then you haven’t worked in the real world enough. I wish the real world rewarded me directly based on the effort I put in, but it doesn’t.  The idea that  you can work hard and get your reward regardless of who you are is escapism of the highest order, and it is the best thing about gaming.  That’s why cheating matters to some people, because it means you got the shiney without the effort, and that devalues the effort the other guy put in by trivializing it.  It’s not a perspective I agree with, but it’s hardly irrational.    The only reason I  happen to disagree with being upset about such things is because games are fundamentally trivial things to begin with.  You can walk away at any time and do something else.  

My point is, and I can’t believe I’m writing this, cheating at Duck Tales is not a moral indictment of either the cheater or the game designer.

Craywulf
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Craywulf

Werewolf Finds Dragon What you need to do with cheaters is look at the kind of cheating and ask yourself why they’re cheating; If the developer is smart, they’re going to realise that most cheaters are doing so because of bad design decisions, and those are going to be things that need to be fixed in the game. Banning people who cheat is just a bandage — a short-term triage — for a problem that’s not going to go away until you fix it.

Going to disagree with you on this. Poker, Chess, Monopoly have it’s share of cheaters. Is the game flawed? No, The flaw is in the mentality of the cheater for thinking the game is broken or their mod is to “fix” the game…..so they can win. Cheaters don’t play games for fun, they play to win at all cost.

I’ve played hard games, and easy games. Even games with bugs, and yet I’ve never felt compelled to cheat because I felt I could fix it.

Madda
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Madda

dirtyklingon Madda Sick projection, bro!

Ehra
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Ehra

Werewolf Finds Dragon 
I encourage everyone to read through this post because it really is incredible, but here’s the TLDR: 
Limited
lives in Duck Tales the video game is an unethical design choice and
walls are bad game design. Immortality cheats are obviously bad and
shouldn’t be allowed but if people use infinite ammo cheats then that
just means your ammo system is poorly designed, even though by that
logic the existence of immortality cheats would mean the health system
is poorly designed but lets ignore that. Now I’m going to rant for 2
paragraphs about achievements and and how dumb extroverts are. *Also
I’m just a person who’s more perspicacious, wise, and keyed into human
nature than most. It’s my jam. I like knowing how people work, and I
enjoy understanding why they complain about something.
 * Literally copy/pasted from the post. Like I said, it’s worth a read.

McSleaz
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McSleaz

Ness199X FiveM is very legit, and they are doing it in a similar way to how they did it for GTA IV, all the info is there in the discussion thread.

Werewolf Finds Dragon
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Werewolf Finds Dragon

I’ve pointed this out in the past but I’ll point it out again.
In most scenarios, the only reason cheaters matter is if they’re using cheats to gain immortality in a game about player versus player competition. Otherwise, the player is only highlighting bad design choices within the game itself, that usually only happen because games are inviting real world concepts like grind, or limited ammo. Follow the rule of fun, and good design practises, and the only real issue you have to worry about is whether they’re cheating to gain immortality.
And there are many ways around them doing that. Simply keep track of damage values and health values on the server end — that’s not hard to do, that’s not an excess of data. Beyond that? Cheaters shouldn’t matter.
I’m sure the accusations will fly thick and fast, but I’m not a cheater in online games, it upsets people and it’s not worth the drama. I’m just a person who’s more perspicacious, wise, and keyed into human nature than most. It’s my jam. I like knowing how people work, and I enjoy understanding why they complain about something.
Consider this: If a person cheats for money to buy a manse, why are other players upset? It’s because there’s money involved. Lose the money. Have the manse provided as part of the story, so if a player skips ahead and gets the manse, it greatly lessens the impact as other people are enjoying the story and they won’t care. It’s this attitude that you have to earn money to buy things in bloody video game that taints everything.
Back in the ’80s and the ’90s, cheater wasn’t an ugly word. There were trainers for every game, there were cartridges for the consoles, and it was accepted that if you’d gotten fed up with a game, you should just cheat. Consider games that have lives, you use your lives and then you’re set back to the beginning of the game. That doesn’t teach you anything, it doesn’t help you, it’s just punishment for the sake of punishment. But why? To artificially extend the life of the game, of course!
We’re wise to that, these days. That’s why games like VVVVVV and Ori & the Blind Forest don’t have lives, it’s why lives were removed from Duck Tales: Remastered. I’d invite you to think about it, because you really should.
What are cheats, most often? A counter to something that someone recognises as bad game design.
Yes, rarely, cheats are an impediment to a game. But that’s only five per cent of the time. In most cases, it really is to highlight/fix bad design choices. The only thing you’d ever need to worry about is a person using cheats for immortality in a PvP game. That’s it. The rest really does just highlight bad design choices. For example: If a lot of people want to cheat to get infinite ammo, then it’s clear that ammo in that game isn’t working, and it should either be reworked or the weapons should use infinite ammo. In fact, before this push toward realism, infinite ammo was a common thing. Part of the Rule of Fun and all that.
What you need to do with cheaters is look at the kind of cheating and ask yourself why they’re cheating; If the developer is smart, they’re going to realise that most cheaters are doing so because of bad design decisions, and those are going to be things that need to be fixed in the game. Banning people who cheat is just a bandage — a short-term triage — for a problem that’s not going to go away until you fix it.
Is a player teleporting through walls? Don’t ban. Put in an ability that allows players to do that and then ban people who continue to cheat. Think that way. Don’t look at cheating as something vile and evil, look at it as simply people who see problems with the game that could be made more fun by cheating. If you have an excess of cheaters, it means that your game has problems. Consider the problems, then ban.
I think most of the problem though comes from this shift toward realism and grind. So you’ll have many extroverted players just doing what they do in real life and grinding their life away just to earn money to buy a fancy house in a bloody video game. And when someone cheats to get a house, it’s an affront to them.
These are the attitudes that we’ve gotten since we’ve been making more realistic games for extroverted players. An extrovert doesn’t have the perspicacity to sit and think that, perhaps, a video game doesn’t equal any kind of achievement, it doesn’t make the person playing it special, and you haven’t really earned anything. You’ve just wasted a bunch of time on a bloody video game. No one is going to remember that you have a certain set of achievements in that video game, no one is going to care.
Those cheevos are pointless, worthless things that say only that a person has spent an excess of their life on a single game when they could’ve moved on to do other things, or could’ve done more creative, constructive things with their time. I always sigh and shake my head at a wall of achievements. To the player, it’s an epitaph, a long-standing tribute to their greatness. To me, it’s something that no one will ever see, notice, or remember. But they don’t realise that, they believe everyone will see, and everyone will remember.
it’s a sad state of affairs.
It’s just a video game, a thing we play in our spare time, for fun. A video game should have no meaning beyond that. It’s a bit of escapism, it’s enjoyment, it’s meant to be outside the real world. It’s not supposed to be a simulation of the real world where you earn accolades for being the best worker ant. Video games should never be that.
In fact, when they are, I just turn my nose up at them. This is why I don’t own GTA V, nor will I ever. What I do own is Saints Row IV, a game where I’ve never cheated because I’ve never felt the need to. That game throws new toys at you so often that you don’t feel like you’re wasting your time playing it. And that’s why people cheat — because they feel that they’re wasting their time playing a game. This is why Saints Row IV will never have a huge cheater problem, and GTA V will.
In the late ’80s, kids cheated at Duck Tales because they felt that having to restart the game over when they lost all their lives was just a waste of their time; A patronising, unethical waste of their time. In the ’10s, people cheat at GTA V because they feel like it’s a waste of their time; A patronising, unethical waste of their time.
But whereas Duck Tales: Remastered fixed its issues, games like GTA V still exist.
The problem isn’t so much the cheater as it is the game itself.

Ness199X
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Ness199X

McSleaz 
As nice as the idea sounds, I have to wonder, how exactly does these fellows plan to use dedicated servers when there is no dedicated server tool and the game uses P2P connections for virtually everything? Makes me wonder a little about how legit it all is.

McSleaz
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McSleaz

http://fivem.net/   Check it out, Rock* can keep their anal retentive servers