As US COVID deaths pass 200,000, the LA ComicCon refuses to cancel

    
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As US COVID deaths pass 200,000, the LA ComicCon refuses to cancel

Since January, we’ve been covering the endless stream of gaming and geek conventions that have closed their doors and gone online in an effort to avoid exacerbating the spread of the deadly COVID pandemic that’s killed over 200,000 people in the US and over a million around the world.

But not the LA Comic Con! This week, organizers told LA Daily News that the event will go on as planned in December, with up to 50,000 people spread out over roughly twice as much space in the convention center as it normally offers, along with other social distancing measures.

“We’re doing everything we can to help nerds unite this December,” general manager Chris DeMoulin says.

LA County’s testing positivity rate is around 3% as I type this, which only looks relatively good because so much of the country and other pockets of the world are so much worse. By way of comparison, the mayor of New York City, which was slammed by the pandemic early on but recovered due to strict health measures, recently said a 2% rate would make him nervous and that hitting 3% would cause him “heart palpitations” and “alarm bells.” Under these circumstances, it’s a hard sell that a ComicCon is such an important event that it’s worth entering a haunted plague box right now, especially one drawing guests from all over the country.

Kotaku commenters speculated that the governor of California will just force the event to close, and in fact the organizers may be anticipating (and hoping for) just that for some sort of insurance reasons.

Be safe out there, folks, and look out for yourselves and your neighbors.

Source: LADN via an appropriately incredulous Kotaku

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Bruno Brito

I lost three people to COVID.

Fuck you, Soren.

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Art of Raw Gaming

380,000,000 Americans.
200,000 deaths.
Let that sink in.

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Bruno Brito

1.4 billion chineses, 4.600 deaths.

Let THAT sink in.

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Armsman

The organizers now say the con will only go forward in person if the LA county Department of health signs off on it.

LA Comic Con Will Only Move Forward if LA County Department of Public Health Signs Off

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Sorenthaz

((Deleted by mod. Not on this site.))

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Tandor

It’s also weird how many people still don’t get that it isn’t just about how likely “the type of audience that would attend an event like this” is to get Covid badly, it’s about all the parents, grandparents and other more vulnerable parts of the community that those people are going to mix with afterwards.

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Sorenthaz

Obviously, but I’d like to reiterate:

Can’t stay locked up and scared of the what-ifs forever

Eventually it hits a point where it’s akin to being scared of driving because there’s always a chance you could get in a crash. Or going outside at all because the chances of death increase due to a vast number of possibilities that can happen from being outside. Can also play smart by, y’know, not interacting with family or going to go see grandma right after going to a convention or whatever.

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Greaterdivinity

Or going outside at all because the chances of death increase due to a vast number of possibilities that can happen from being outside.

Man, you’re just in this comments sections with the worst fuckin strawmen.

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Greaterdivinity

200k number but not the actual death rate which is abysmally low

Because 200K is a fucking LOT in 7 months? That surpasses almost every war the US has been involved in to-date (save for a few like the Civil War and WWII, but we’ve got some years to catch up to those numbers), and is the second largest mass-casualty event only behind the 1918 Flu Pandemic. It absolutely shatters every other virus outbreak that’s happened in all of our lifetimes.

Honestly, who gives a shit about “BUT THE DEATH RATE IS LOW!” when you have more than 200K Americans dead in less than a year due to a failed response to a pandemic?

The mortality rate in the US, last I checked, is around 3%. That’s HUGE, and compared to ye-old favorite “the seasonal flu”, that sits at .1%. Not 1%, POINT 1 percent.

Society wasn’t built to stay locked up for 6+ months

You’re right! Which is why this time calls for extraordinary measures. Also why this should cause countries to re-evaluate how they operate from top to bottom to better handle pandemics in the future. They’re coming, it’s a “when” not an “if”.

and this is being done in December while still following social distancing guidelines and all that jazz

How are you going to police social distancing at a convention with thousands/tens of thousands? It’s mostly indoors, which is the worst place one can be right now. And December adds more complicating factors including peak flu season. This is about as bad a take as GDC thinking they could do an in-person event in August after canceling the show in March.

Can’t stay locked up and scared

I’ll take the slap from the MOP staff for this, but go fuck yourself and fuck right the hell off. We’re not “scared”, which is a common attempt to discredit the VERY JUSTIFIED CONCERNS about a fucking pandemic. We’re rightfully cautious.

Are you “scared” to go to your car because there’s a bear standing next to it? Probably. AND THAT’S A GOOD FUCKIN THING BECAUSE THAT’S A FUCKIN BEAR AND THEY DO NOT FUCK AROUND. I’m higher risk myself. I have a good friend who lives close by who is MUCH higher risk that I’ve seen only a few times since all this. My brother is higher risk. My parents are BOTH higher risk. My grandmother is EXTREMELY high risk. My concern isn’t just for myself, because the effects of the virus on the body even if you survive are still being learned about (including early data indicating it could considerably increase chances of getting Parkinsons amongst survivors), but for my family that I have to also interact with in a limited and safe capacity from time to time.

In summation: Treating a global pandemic that’s shown to have a high rate of death (3% is high for diseases), easy transmission, and a mountain of early data indicating that the virus can have long-lasting detrimental health impacts on survivors like IT’S KINDA A SERIOUS FUCKIN DEAL is smart.

And the 200K deaths in the US is an absolute travesty, and completely unnecessary if this country had acted more quickly, seriously, and Americans had shown themselves as willing to make minor personal sacrifices for their country and fellow countrymen/women as generations in the past have.

Covynant001
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Covynant001

((Deleted by mod.))

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Greaterdivinity

In war you take acceptable losses, and this very much is a war.

This ain’t a war, my dude. You signing up to be on the “front lines”? I mean, apparently we’re all living in some strange capitalist death cult where we must sacrifice ourselves at the corporate alter.

If the world economy collapses your going to see death on a far more massive scale than what the virus did.

Why do folks keep treating the economy like it’s a “thing” that exists independently? Like, I get that every country can’t just print massive amounts of money and inflate the hell outta the economy but like, you’ve got this defeatists attitude where countries are apparently incapable of doing anything financially to prop up an economy during a pandemic where millions of low income workers are suffering. When the reality is they very much can.

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Schmidt.Capela

The economic impact of the high hospitalization rates and deaths caused by not taking COVID-19 seriously is quite likely higher than any economic damage a proper lockdown — like what New Zealand implemented, which basically eradicated COVID-19 from the country — would have caused. So, when you actually take the economic damage a rampant epidemy causes into account — as anyone doing a proper analysis should do — the best path forward for protecting and recovering the economy revolves around using all available means — including strict lockdowns — to contain and, if possible, eradicate the disease.

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Jack Pipsam

As is often the case, New Zealand is a gold standard for all to be jealous of.

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Schmidt.Capela

the actual death rate which is abysmally low for the type of audience that would attend an event like this

Most of them wouldn’t even show any symptoms.

Which is actually very troublesome, because all those asymptomatic carriers would then go around, unaware that they are spreading the disease while infecting people around them — people who often aren’t as resistant to the disease as the young nerds that attend such a ‘con. It could easily become a superspreader event, undoing much of the gains against the disease painstakingly made by multiple US states and indirectly causing enormous economic damage by requiring even more restrictions to regain the lost ground in the fight against COVID-19.

Society wasn’t built to stay locked up for 6+ months,

The virus doesn’t care. Remove all efforts for containing it and the number of infected people will increase quickly and exponentially, which would be a disaster even with the current “low” death rate of about 3%. Worse, if you exceed the health system’s capacity to treat the infected, the death rate of the untreated will be much higher.

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dreamer

Just because you’re over it, doesn’t mean it’s over.

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sophiskiai

waving around the 200k number but not the actual death rate

A lot of the people who try to downplay the seriousness of the pandemic wave around the death rate while ignoring the fact that many of those who are hospitalised from Covid and survive are left with permanent organ damage. It’s suspected that even those who have fairly mild symptoms may possibly suffer long-term effects.

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/07/brain-fog-heart-damage-covid-19-s-lingering-problems-alarm-scientists

Can’t stay locked up and scared of the what-ifs forever unless this is some sort of dystopian movie scenario.

2020 is a dystopian movie scenario! And we still have 25% of it left to go :(

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Jack Pipsam

Bruh wtf, what a bunch of idiots to run a convention during all this. That’s the sort of thing which will just prolong the virus with adding extra bumps and spikes along the way.

It’s so weird seeing companies be so blasé about all this, especially as where I’m from is somehow considered a police state during all this and we have like ten cases a day now lol.

Covynant001
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Covynant001

That your government acknowledges…

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Schmidt.Capela

You can get a good idea of whether a government is hiding COVID-19 numbers by looking at two metrics.

One is the number of deaths attributed to respiratory problems of unknown cause; when there are deficiencies in testing, deaths that should have been attributed to COVID-19 are instead reported as something else, usually respiratory problems. Any country that has had a sharp increase in this kind of death is either testing far less than it should or else trying to doctor the numbers.

The second metric is excess deaths, the number of deaths above the average of the previous years. This one is less precise because other reasons — such as less deaths in car accidents due to people working from home and travelling less — can interfere, but can still be quite insightful; the US, for example, had 169K confirmed COVID-19 deaths between March 1st and August 16, but had 260K excess deaths in the same period, which (unless you can find other reasons for excess deaths) is a strong indication that the real number of US COVID-19 deaths is over 50% higher than the official numbers.

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Ravven

So much this. I think people don’t understand the importance of excess mortality figures – the number of deaths is obviously much higher than is officially reported (in most countries, not just the US).

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Bruno Brito

Brazil undernotifies heavily. There’s a suspicion that the number of deaths here is over 2x.

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Jack Pipsam

I don’t know why you’d think that the Victorian Department of Health and Human Services is lying about or withholding the numbers 🤷.
It is widely acknowledged that the true number is most likely higher as is the case everywhere in the world, however unless those people get tested then that information just isn’t going to be there.

We had a peak of over 700 cases in my state last month, we’re now down to between 5-15 cases a day, it’s an incredible result from what was a scary increase, but we only managed it due to actually doing things.
Forced social distancing, masks, preventing movement, placing a border between metro and regional, strong fines for breaches etc. All necessarily steps to achieve the results.

To be loosey-goosey about COVID restrictions and enforcement means that there won’t be real progress other than sheer dumb luck.

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Fisty

They’re definitely holding out for insurance. How many guests will they actually get to show up if it does go through? Comic shops will and should go if struggling this year, as their business has taken a huge hit and something has to be done to keep them alive.

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Bruno Brito

How many guests will they actually get to show up if it does go through?

You are doubting the desperation and stupidity of people who never understood the concept of self-isolation.

This week, 30 or so people gathered on my street for a beer party, on my neighboors’ home.

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Fisty

Guests as in comic book writers, artists, not guests as in rando off the street.

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Bruno Brito

The virus doesn’t infect only the artistry. Anyone can carry this shit.

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Fisty

Just shut up. Why must you reply to me? I decided to stop replying to you. Return the favor. The point was if artists/writers dont show, they don’t have much of a comic convention. They’re holding out to be ordered to shut to get an insurance check. I live in idiot trumpland, you can’t tell me anything I don’t know. I’m not encouraging people to go socialize. If a comic store is about to shut down and thinks they can survive, then should go, because they’re not getting any help from anywhere else. Not everyone has the luxury of staying at home to avoid it.

Andrew Ross
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Andrew Ross

It’s never been the best con, but it’s a lot of fun. I used it to do a test run of my Peter B Parker Halloween costume last year and it was a ton of fun (though a bit hard on my back since the kiddos loved it). No way I’m going this year though. I’m super disappointed in their choice.

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flying_dutchman

((Deleted by mod. Read the room.))

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Greaterdivinity

I mean overpopulation is a serious issue after-all.

Cool, are you going to be first in line to sacrifice mom/dad or grandma/grandpa for the sake of “personal choice” and to address “overpopulation”?

And governments absolutely have a role to play during public health crisis and international pandemics. That’s literally a threat to the nation and one of the core responsibilities for a government to respond to, including working to inform their populace and advising/mandating best practices for individual and collective safety.

I mean, remember all those proud Brits during WWII that refused to turn their lights off at night because it was a “personal choice” and who gives a shit if their neighbors get bombed to shit? Those Americans who proudly looted donation drives for scrap metal or nylon or stole from victory gardens because those were all “personal choices”?

Neither do I. As an American, you’re being incredibly un-American, at least if you think about what “ideals” America supposedly stood/stands for. Though you’re doing a great job of living up to the negative stereotype that Americans have been earning in recent decades, kudos to you.

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flying_dutchman

That has nothing to do with Anything… and your just raging about how I have no empathy and I’m a terrible person…. without actually getting the point… Your occluding the issues with hyperbole.

The government shouldn’t have to TELL PEOPLE TO STAY AT HOME. They shouldn’t have to CLOSE DOWN COMICON.. because American’s should be smart enough not to go.

You should do it of your own choice for the safety of yourself, your family, the country, and the world. Being a human being who has empathy for his fellow man IS WHY YOU SHOULDN’T GO.

And no, I haven’t lost anyone to Corvid yet thank Buddha, but I do have 2 cousins and an Aunt with it currently. They however didn’t get it going to a massive convention with 1000’s of strangers.

If you have lost someone to corvid. I honestly feel for you, but I have little sympathy for people who actively court the disease, because they are never the ones who suffer for it.

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dreamer

We have government precisely because people aren’t smart enough to govern themselves. The average person is an idiot.

Source: I’m a Floridian.

Theryl
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Theryl

Blackout regulations were legally enforced and you’d have the police or air raid wardens knocking on your door if light was visible from the street. The same thing applies to public health – measures have to be legally enforceable because some people are too selfish, ignorant, and/or stupid to do what is necessary for the public good. This is a lesson that was learned the hard way over the course of the late 19C and early 20C combatting polio, typhoid, cholera, measles, and all the other epidemics we don’t get anymore because of public health measures and mass vaccination.

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BalsBigBrother

You can fuck right off with the shitty, selfish and completely fucked attitude.

Oh I dunno did it ever occur to you to think that maybe some folks might have lost friends or relatives during this pandemic and how they might feel seeing their grief dismissed as “I mean over population is a serious issue after-all”

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Bruno Brito

I mean overpopulation is a serious issue after-all.

Grow out of that garbage. This eco-fascist nihilism is something that only the most idiot of teenagers preach as good philosophy.

Yes, overpopulation is a issue. So? That doesn’t change that people are suffocatting to death or living with permanent damage because of a sickness that can be controlled with knowledge and empathy.

You probably didn’t lose anyone to this shit.

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Jack Pipsam

Is overpopulation an issue?
Sure.
But the idea that a virus is the ‘solution’ (ugh) to this is far off the base, it’s literally the goal of villains in all kinds of stories.

Overpopulation is solved simply by having less children and that normally happens once a society is at a point where things are good, happy, healthy and incomes are good. By raising more out of poverty, you will lower the birthrate.

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MilitiaMasterV

As someone who wears a face SHIELD + face-mask in a rural nowhere town who’s been getting death stares and watched as people ignore it all and think it’s just a hoax and continue normal pre-lockdown behaviors…

(Including large groups with no social distancing…I just saw 3 ‘Cross Country’ training groups of high school students running in large gaggles down the road just chatting away the last time I went grocery shopping, and have seen people regularly congregating at the bars, and riding a party bus around town…along with a motorcycle ‘gang’ roll through town…and another group of children sitting beside the local convenience store in a 13 person group just eating a meal together with no spacing at all between them. Along with numerous store staff people who mis-wear/don’t wear masks…including the guy when I went into the convenience store the day before yesterday who had his mask hanging by one ear, who, when he saw me, put it on…implying he thinks I’m the one he needs to be afraid of, and not the hundreds of other people who come in and just breath all over his face without masks…)

…who has severe asthma…and is likely to die when/if I get it, I’ve just been avoiding humanity as much as possible/refusing to even leave my apartment.

This area didn’t spike much early on because rural areas are spread so thin people-wise, but as other areas were dropping off their first peak and starting to re-open, we were still gaining (And didn’t really have much of a lock-down to begin with because we have a Republican governor who disregards science.)…and so it began spiking out here. The hospital to the northeast of us released information showing 89.4% spread rate in our regional area, but people keep saying ‘I don’t believe them/trust their information’ because they are paranoid and think people are just trying to scare them or take away some kind of rights. (Always forgetting that once you’re dead, you don’t need rights, because you just don’t exist.)

I’m still not even sure we’re off the first peak yet.

My neighbor lost his grandma. They wouldn’t even let them see the body to pay their respects, and they also put down her animals because they weren’t sure if it could spread that way.

It’s almost like people are trying to win Darwin Awards.

Canceling a event that is about fun, and revolves around money, to save lives…which are all that really matter in continuing the fun and collection of money…is what should matter. But for some reason, people seem to think they take money with them to the grave…

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Schmidt.Capela

Actually, history tells us that imposing restrictions to protect the public health during an epidemy results in a better economy down the road than trying to keep things open and weathering the disease. This was true during the 1918 flu pandemic, and the numbers up to now indicate it should also happen with COVID-19.

MilitiaMasterV
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MilitiaMasterV

Not sure why you aimed that comment at me, when I support science/doing proper things to deal with the virus, and already knew your factoid.

My comment pointed out that economy only exists to those who are alive to benefit from it.

My local area for the most part, doesn’t believe in science, and is fanatical about religion instead. They think the ‘plagues’ have come to take them to their god and they are doing everything in their power to get there faster because they believe they are going somewhere better than here…(Ironically forgetting that their own belief system states committing suicide is a sin and would thwart them from going there, thus showing they would all be going to their version of ‘down there’ instead, as their actions are akin to suicide.)

I don’t believe this kind of thing, because I’m a hybrid between an atheist/agnostic/Buddhist/Taoist.

I’m not much of a numbers person myself (learning disabilities made math not one of my strong suits), but I read plenty of articles from actual economists…sadly, a lot of the current ones are focused on the ‘now’ and instead fear-mongering that ‘the world’s going to end’ if the economy has a slump (It does that every so often…) which leads people to believe ‘We have to keep it going or else!’…

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Jack Pipsam

Where I live my state’s official motto throughout all this has been “Staying Apart Keeps Us Together”, it’s sad a lot of people just don’t get it, it’s so simple but it’s correct. Unless people are willing to give up basic things and do the right thing there, the chance of going back to a normal is near impossible and even as the virus will one way or another move on, what will be left behind will be chaos and a sheer amount of devastation and death which could have been largely prevented by simple things like just staying apart.

It’s sad people are so willing to forsake lives and the future for short-term kicks.

In our case where I lived, it required force. A lot of people here weren’t doing the right thing by going to beaches or parting, so as our second-wave began the state had to kick into overdrive and legally place all sorts of heavy restrictions in place, because that’s what it was going to take, force.
The people had to be treated like misbehaving children, because that’s what was really happening by the blatant disregard for taking COVID seriously.

We reached our state peak on the 5th of August, 725 cases, just a couple days after everyone over the age of 12 was legally required to wear a mask.
People acted like spoiled babies, kicking and screaming about this “infringement of human rights” (snort) because of having to wear masks, by not allowed to have parties, having a nightly curfew, splitting the state in half by having a police/army check-point between Melbourne and the regional areas, closing playgrounds and all kinds of other things.
I believe some international press has covered this situation, calling Victoria a police state, our Premier coming under heavy fire and criticism for his heavy-handed tactics to make people comply in order to do the right thing.

Two days ago, just under two months later, the entire state recorded just 5 new cases.
It worked.

Masks worked. Social distancing worked.
Yet even with this clear evidence people are still crying and whinging about these rules despite without them we’d have thousands upon thousands of daily cases and a horrific amount of death, like is seen in the United States, France, the UK etc., which would have spread across borders possibly and would put the entire nation’s future in real economic damage further than already is.

The actions of our Premier saved the lives of thousands of people and has allowed our entire nation the chance to start its recovery while most of the world still is floundering with COVID.
And his reward for this? Political suicide and the mainstream press calling for his resignation.

People are idiots.

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MilitiaMasterV
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MilitiaMasterV

Looking at the CDC (Centers for Disease Control) numbers for Iowa :

Total cases : 86,999
Total deaths : 1,321
Cases in last 7 days : 6,259
Deaths in last 7 days : 47

I wish we had those kind of ‘It’s not spreading’ numbers, but I seem to be in the ‘thick of it’ here.

Yeah, sure, those numbers look low, compared to city center areas with huge populations, but all it takes is 1 person to get infected, to become a vector for multiple other people to become infected. So that one person, can exponentially grow it. If those people would do something to protect themselves/others, we could maybe get ahead of this some, and less people would have to watch someone they love die. But America seems to have created a lot of selfish/narcissistic sociopaths that enjoy watching people die.

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Hikari Kenzaki

Yeah, they’re probably just hoping to get the mandatory cancel for the insurance.