Star Citizen is balancing the crap out of ship weapons as the Crytek lawsuit drags on

Chris Roberts is joined by CIG Leader Writer Dave Haddock for this week’s episode of Star Citizen Around the Verse, during which they check in with multiple studio reps who reinforce the decision to move to quarterly releases as well as better organize projects within the individual studios to actually deliver 3.0.1. And the deep-dive this week? It’s all about weapons. Pew pew. Specifically weapon balancing.

“We want to make sure that each weapon type – say the scatter gun – is relatively balanced towards a cannon weapon type or a hypothetical beam cannon type,” Tech Designer Andrew Nicholson explains. “So the scatter gun will do more damage that a regular cannon but obviously it’s rate of fire is slower. And we just make sure that all these parameters fit in the correct range that we give them on a per size basis, and that nothing is too strong or too weak.”

Meanwhile, the Crytek lawsuit continues. As of yesterday, the judge in the suit canceled the hearing with oral arguments set for today, noting she would be considering the existing arguments for and against dismissal.

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AngryPacifist

Crytek is now Cringetek with their phony, fake lawsuit. NEVER going to buy anything from that conpany again. I hope they go bankrupt for good

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Armsman

As for the CRYTEK lawsuit, when the Judge takes a motion like that under submission and cancels arguments, that usually means they’re going to rule along the lines of existing case law – and given Crytek’s novel interpretation of ‘exclusive’ and that they omitted a copy of the actual GLA in their initial complaint; I’d say it bodes bad for Crytek’s hopes of prevailing big; or getting a large settlement.

The Judge will probably not dismiss the case outright; but she’ll exclude a lot of what Crytek is claiming they’re owed damages for, to the point Crytek may not pursue the case further, but we’ll see.

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shear

Excluding things out of the lawsuit is normal, in fact, it’s a common practice to try and attach as many possible claims as you can. It is unlikely that they would be able to file again if it got dismissed, so you throw a bunch of shit at the wall hoping for something to stick, and that’s all they need, one thing to stick.

I have one issue with Crytek’s claim after reading about it a bit, which I think is going to be what kills it for them, but we’ll see.

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CasualSlacks

Frankly, I’m not playing SC right now. I’m fine with waiting for later iterations of features that they’ve only just introduced. If I need a fix, I’ll get in Elite.

CapnLan
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CapnLan

I’ll get more excited about weapons once the servers can actually handle combat. I get around 25-30 just running cargo and drops to 7 in combat. After a bunch of pirate caterpillars interdicted me I dropped to 4. Have you ever tried to dogfight at 4-7 fps? It’s literally unplayable, and not in the facetious way that phrase is used these days. I don’t think I can get excited about anything SC is going to be doing in the future until they can get what they already have running better.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

i’m impressed you manage to complete running cargo. >>

everything breaks for me every time i get to some arbitrary point in the process. and i’ve seen a fairly decent number of other people report the same.

CapnLan
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CapnLan

Yeah it’s been a mess but I can sort of get it to work using my Avenger Titan. Seems like the less cargo I haul, the better things hold together. Even just using a Cutlass filled up gave me problems. Of course I don’t make much money doing that way but it’s the only way I can get things to hold up.

Ultimately the greatest danger is the servers. I just never know if they’re going to crash and take all my cargo with em.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

i’ve been limiting my own attempts to cargo object missions but have been reading along other’s and seen straight up game ending scenarios play out.

as well as probably unintentionally mentioned below bit about ship packages going missing bugs >>

cmdr_cotic
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cmdr_cotic

With the above in mind the latest ATV should have been called Bringing Balance To The Farce.

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Totes McGoats

Spot on.

B8F074DC-BF88-425B-8179-AA408D25D491.gif
deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

CIG RT’ed someone calling the cargo system the most immersive trading experience in a game ever this week! totally not spreadsheet based (despite the availability of spreadsheet cheat sheets to know where to buy and sell to makea profit at all).

except 9 times out of ten various things related to all things cargo and cargo bin mission objectives will break. which making pure trade the most lucrative but riskiest gameplay loop as you are buying the cargo that things will likely break and you will lose that cargo with no way to easily recoup your money you just lost due to the game breaking but keeping the persistence of that stuff between sessions (ie not the cargo being there but the money spent on it being gone).

anyways this was somewhat amusing if unrewarding session recently:

which resulted in some nice views and confirmation that turning on PRE or landing gear down mode against pirate NPCs makes them far easier to kill.

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Space Captain Zor

Good thing you’re testing the cargo loop for them then ;)

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

this is not a viable environment for testing it. you run out of money you are out of money until the next wipe.

also you better tell CIG’s marketting team that we’re “testing”. becuase they don’t seem to know it. certainly are promoting it as *playing* and in much better shape than it even remotely is.

there’s good reason there’sa visible decrease in in game populations (from the server population meter when friends are playing) from 2.6 and ptu, topping out at about an average of 10 per instance.

but you know what 3.0.1 added? monocles and top hats for whales. cuz priorities.

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Lethality

The fact remains is it’s an alpha product. It says so right on the box.

Testing is implicit.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

no it’s not. hasn’t been for ages.

even more than 10 years ago now promotional betas and such were demos with a caveat to be played and trial out th egame before buying.

the fact that the gmae company in question is promoting it as a fun full gmaeplay experience regularly on their social media nd promotional material explicitly negates your silly implication that doesn’t exist in this day and age eve if they didn’t do that.

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Lethality

So, it’s in terrible, almost non-playable shape – but the reason is not because it’s an alpha-phase project. I see.

This is an *actual* alpha. There’s no denying that any early access title will paint the product in the best light possible, because they’re still funding the game. Go see how every other early access game is promoted on social media. Star Citizen is no different.

I’m certain as well that you have a choice – to not play – until it’s in a state beyond alpha.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

i think you are fundamentally misunderstanding my criticism here.

i don’t have a problem with it being in an alpha state. i take issue with their marketting it aggressively as if it’s not in the state it’s in.

and typical high interest alpha state early access game tends to be in much better shape from day 1 of early access than star citizen has been in ever in it’s going on 5 years of early access.

and most people who have been playing regularly over the years aren’t playing right now. despite 3.0 being the big milestone CIG promotes as being when the masses of backers should be interested to start playing like one would any other big early access game.

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Lethality

I can somewhat agree. But that’s the evil side of all marketing, to be honest, right?

The downfall of Star Citizen is that it’s not only taken much longer than they said it would; it’s taking much longer than players/backers think it *should* – and most of them have no valid reference to judge by.

We can almost adopt a dog-years metaphor for Star Citizen. Every normal year of game development = 3 years of Star Citizen development!

Which means technically, we’re at the stage every other game would be after 2 years!! :) Looks good when you say it like that, no?? ;)

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

no just no. the ones setting expectations for when should happen are CIG. not fans. not randoms on the internet. but CIG themselves.

they’ve done it continually over the past 6 years and continue to do it now.

not fans. CIG.

we have plenty of valid reference for how long it shoul’dve taken, based on a vast wealth of discussion and exploration of how video game development typically works in both development hell and “smoothly run” projects. and we know from this project has done things ass backwards on a fundemental ongoing basis and completely out of touch with development priorities.

and this is a paradigm that continues with this project and how they communicate with us.

and people like you defend it and act like the people who criticise it are ignorant, when in fact it is ignorant to defend it in such an insulting manner as if we don’t live in an era of developers being happy to talk about w/e game and what’s going on with it and early access titles launching for money in alpha states.

for a typical early access title it would be insane to launch with what 3.0 is right now in the state it is now for the low cost of $20usd without a cash shop. evne if you got media exposure for strong day 1 sales, consumers would rip you apart for years to come. and they do for far less agregrious practices in teh early access games with products that have launched and maintained better quality states since day 1 of their early access periods.

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Lethality

It doesn’t matter what CIG does. Fans will *always* set expectations of their own… see: every fucking early access game that whiny brats feel like bitching about.

If you want to get into it, it is *players* that created these awful business models like f2p, crowdfunding, early access and more. Ifyo were just willing to PAY for the games you wanted to play, this wouldn’t be an issue.

I paid $89 for my copy of Wing Commander – and I’m pretty sure I never saw an update for it. Today players expect huge, free multiplayer games with constant content and not drop a dime on it.

Players are the problem.™

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

yeah man, i know us players get together for meetings to concoct ever more predatory business models we’d like to pay into and decietful marketting campaigns and fubar the develop of games we want to play.

i mean sandi shouldn’t get credit for star citizen’s revenue model. no it should be tom jackass the fan that is frustrated by getting finger fucked monthly with weekly marketting spam monthly concept sales and rushed milestones that are exalted as when th emasses should play – which it’s also tom jackasse’s fault for making the game company tell people this is when the game will be legitimately worth playing.

totally!

Godnaz
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Godnaz

no just no. the ones setting expectations for when should happen are CIG. not fans. not randoms on the internet. but CIG themselves.

DK has a point in that they couldn’t get funding without portraying the game as a ‘vision’ of what it should play like when the ‘game’ is finish. CIG is swallowing the poison pill they created by asking for public funding. DK keeps referring to this as a game when it has no solid game loop foundation. It’s not even a game yet and with the poor choices made early on coming back to bite them with this long development process, they deserve the flack they get from pledgers.

Both of you have played this alpha extensively. I think you can both agree for all the great tech and scope that’s come out of it so far, it’s still highly mismanaged from a players point of view. Along with a boat load of pledged cash, comes the burden of their actions in going this route. Yet, this project would have never gotten off the ground had CR and his marketing team told the truth.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

yes, the past 3 or so years of progress has been great. if not for the marketting/comms noize.

idk, i feel they could do better for the long term and short term if they were more upfront and honest and realistic, but maybe i’m wrong about this and the only thing driving this project to completion is clear intentional bullshitting the playerbase and potential customers. at least in the ongoing cycle of continual early access until such time as it launches or w/e (assuming it ever launches)

i’m heavily invested in this project monetarily. i do not want it to fail. and because i do not want it to fail i don’t want backers who have it on the back burner and just waiting or new customrs to be enticed into a state of the game which is as shit as the current reality of the game is. i don’t think it’s healthy for anyone at all.

Godnaz
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Godnaz

i’m heavily invested in this project monetarily. i do not want it to fail. and because i do not want it to fail i don’t want backers who have it on the back burner and just waiting or new customrs to be enticed into a state of the game which is as shit as the current reality of the game is. i don’t think it’s healthy for anyone at all.

I’m not sure if I should give you credit or not, DK. I’m speculating on when you bought in but at some point you stopped listening to the noise on both sides and took the pledge dive for yourself to find out what was really going on. You understand that it’s not what CIG is portraying as this semi-finished space life. You also see through the DS/Goon bullshit tactics and understand their motives.

If anything, you paid into one of the biggest risks and best dramas in gaming history. Behind those many bottles of Grey Goose is some clarity and I’m glad to see you know it’s not fuckin grandeur. It’s an organized, misleading mess and your willing to ride it to see where it goes.

TBH, I don’t think you and Lethality are far apart on where you see things. I do think Lethality has gotten so use to defending this project, he’s a bit rose tinted to its critical faults.

You are both funding a dream no other publisher/developer was willing to try because in a gaming business world of season passes, micro-transactions and loot boxes, there is no need to push the boundaries. Unfortunately your captain leading this new risky endeavor is not a hero. He’s not even a realist. He’s currently your only voice of saying you’ve had enough and you expect more out of the gaming industry as it sits today.

Godspeed and I hope to serve aboard your ship someday. o7

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

i backed in early 2013. i whaled last holiday season between gamescon sale and citcon. i’ve played semi regularly since 2013 in the first hangar module.

i’m going where it takes me, but at the same time here and occasionally on reddit i’d like to spread in limited fashion what the game is truly like at the current time and show some legit raw video of what can expect.

idk that chris roberts couldn’t get a publisher onboard. we know he had investors on board before the kickstarter and we know he shrugged them off at some point. we also have reason to believe he has investors for a couple years now.

as far as the MT/cash shop goes. i have no problem spending in cash shops or paying2win to a degree, i just prefer to be honest with myself and others what i am spending on – and i’m far happier to spend on aesthetic/cosmetic things alone.

when the time comes where this game gets to a very good place i’ll be inviting anyone and all to come play with me even in short limited sessions if the game allows it withojut too much trouble for all involved. i reallllllllly want to play with more friends in general and it’s a piss off that this milestone was rushed as it was while being promoted like it is.

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Bruno Brito

Lethality was a joke before. Will always be one.

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Bruno Brito

Players are the problem.™

I been here enough times to actually get tired of your crap.

YOU are the first to complain about players boycotting devs without a care for the money they receive. YOU are the first to defend the poor poor devs who enter these f2p schemes to “feed their families” or some poor excuse like that.

It gets to a point where no one else around here respects you because we all know how on the deep end of the spectrum, you are.

Let me put this into simple perspective, so you don’t miss around the edges:

STAR CITIZEN MOVED MILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO BE MADE. CHRIS ROBERTS IS EVERYTHING, EXCEPT A POOR DEV.

I can’t be clear enough about this. He DOESN’T need your damn help. and NO ONE needs your damn empty criticism. Deekay spent money out of his own POCKET to “test” the waters of this damn alpha, and you’re defending a company that made a game containing a bug that made his money simply disappear. Are you dense, or just doesn’t give a damn about anyone else’s money and effort?

I don’t give two halfs of a shit if this is a fucking alpha. This is a bug that fucks up economy in game, and it’s a game that deliberately allows you to invest IRL money in it. This has DIRECT IMPACT on someone’s wallet, and yet, you fucking defend it, because in your mind, a player cannot defend himself from predatory businesses without being a “whiny brat”.

Holy shit, son. Grow up.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

hey man appreciate the sentiment but i gotta be real here:

most of my dollars spent on this thing came at a time of huge doubt in this project for many. and i decided to reinforce based on what i saw in bullshot demos.

i do not regret that decision.

nor do i regret bringing yall reall legit videos of what people can realistically expect to experience one way or the other. even if i have some fun doing so (and purely talking gameplay wise, no schaedenfreude there).

chris robrts never played me personally. but maybe he has others. i straight up worry about the day that is coming where other smaller backers jump in here due to CIG marketting and it just makes me glad idk who got the word out to wait right now despite that marketting.

anyways again appreciate the sentiment alot. and apreciate the back up too. thanks man.

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Bruno Brito

I’m not saying you should be regretting anything.

I’m saying it’s fucking embarassing for a company to monetize a alpha game and play catch with your money without ironing bugs, yeah, it was a risk you took, and you took it knowingly, but so what?

Does that makes it better? A company monetizing a fucking ALPHA?

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

no i hear ya bro.

i just want to admit my own culpability in enabling them to do so.

the silliness to which this game is monetized is rediculous to say the least. and the marketting on top of that is insane. nevermind the usual suspects every week trying to defend it in silly ways.

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Bruno Brito

But that’s the evil side of all marketing, to be honest, right?

This line will be your downfall, someday.

You’re clearly a developer sucker, but honestly, nothing is worse than someone who knights for predatory marketing schemes.

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Lethality

I think you guys have some things to learn about marketing…

View post on imgur.com

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

somehow i don’t think lays is taking 150 birrion dollars for natural cheetos 20 years in advance and serving customers something inedible and then calling them testers when the complain and telling them it’s their fault this happened.

but yeah marketting bro.

Estranged
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Estranged

Lethality, I spent 4 years in business school. Roberts fails on marketing badly, in the long term. He is lucky to have a captive audience, craving a space game so badly.

You never raise the expectation level of your customer higher than what you can achieve consistently.

Also, you don’t frakking lie. He is a damn liar.

The enormous pot of cash he has acquired does not make him a good marketer. His brand has a bad reputation.

Estranged
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Estranged

Lethality, did you just pull some sort of bandwagon argument? Did you just justify hyperbole and a little fudging of the facts on their part?

Shameless.

cmdr_cotic
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cmdr_cotic

Are you ready for more?

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Oleg Chebeneev

What you mean by “cargo breaks”?

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=star+citizen+cargo+breaking

oh let me count the days of which there are vastly more than summer days…

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Oleg Chebeneev

So I had a bug in early alpha and suggest to switch back to spreadsheet system that every crappy MMO has instead of fixing the bug?

Im glad you arent in charge

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

this isn’t what you original posted

“Oh you again complain about bugs in early alpha. Okey”

and it’s not just one bug. and it’s for a milestone that was hyped to the nines for over a year and currently being marketted heavily as all backers and even new customers should get in and start playing because this is when the full game experience is taken shape.

when getting people to try the game right now is just going to piss them off for a long time to come if not push them to seek refunds and spread negative word of mouth.

but ye, obviously we should just rt those videos showing unrealsitically romnatic gameplay snippets and overly glowing testimonials and negative fps 4k screenshots and not talk about the current state of the game that is being marketted as fully and adequately playable experience for existing backers and new players alike.

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Oleg Chebeneev

Noone prohibits you to talk about game’s state and its bugs. But you make it look like this new item system is garbage and its better to go back to spreadsheet like EVE Online. Just because some people in alpha in very rare cases had their packages disappear due to bug. This is rediculous.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

i’m sure if ccp wanted to they could make a 3d representation of cargo in the hold of your ship.

you also act like you don’t know how the game’s cargo trade loop works in game play. hint: it’s not much different from eve’s, just not player driven.

there are tonnes of bugs with this. the game is literally broken in so many ways right now if you do anything but land on planets and pew pew pirates without expecting a reward for doing so.

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Bruno Brito

> very rare cases had their packages disappear due to bug.

In a sandbox, player-driven economy game, that’s HUGE.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

this is paid for with irl cash ship packages btw that he’s referring to.

i’m not sure why he thought this was a minor thing or a defense. ><

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Bruno Brito

Maybe his money is worth more than yours for some reason?

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

not my money i haven’;t dealt with this yet thankfully. but i don’t doubt for a minute the people who have ben affected

major edit!

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Bruno Brito

SC drama is fun, but the people who defend this crap are bordering zealotry. It’s taxing my patience, honestly.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

ye i see that above. hopefully my reply to that comes through as intended.

Cyclone Jack
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Cyclone Jack

“very rare cases had their packages disappear due to bug.”
Out of the dozens of attempts, I have completed one cargo run. I wouldn’t say they were very rare cases. In fact, I would say the opposite, that actually completing a cargo run would be very rare.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

the worst thing is this is ship packages dissapear from teh in game spawn menu.

like that thing you paid $150 for can dissapear due to bugs.

“but it’s minor”.

Estranged
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Estranged

DK, thanks, I’ll wait to download (unless someone will fly me around).

BTW, I can tell the FPS is hot garbage.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

hmu i’ll take you on a sight seeing tour in a ship you can walk around while seeing the sights lol.

Estranged
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Estranged

Cool, cool!

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus

it’s funny in retrospct a single raw video of the game and run down of it caused so much controvery amongst these guys. as always pretty clear they don’t play the game. if they did they know better how to defend it and when and when not to. instead you’ve got fools like oleg here being well, a fool. and zor and lethalty defeinideing it against phantoms.

and the worst part is? they do it across the internet. every single site that reports on star citizen and has a comment section they are there.

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esd

“We’ve secretly replaced their space game with Warehouse Simulator 2014. Let’s see if the players notice!”

But seriously, that retrieval mission would be silly even if it did work.
– Find a wrecked ship, likely destroyed by weapons fire
– Fight or chase off some pirates
– SHUT DOWN EVERYTHING AND BECOME SITTING DUCK WHILE PICKING UP A BOX

Scoops, tractor beams and drones would all be far superior. As it is, the far future has less automation than an Amazon warehouse.

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Alex Willis

a hypothetical beam cannon

I see what you did there, Star Citizen.

deekay_plus
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deekay_plus