Massively OP’s Best of 2017 Awards: Most Anticipated MMORPG of 2018 and Beyond

    
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Massively Overpowered’s end-of-the-year 2017 awards continue today with our award for Most Anticipated MMORPG, which was awarded to Star Citizen last year for the third year in a row, though it was an incredibly close vote. (And yes, we recognize the irony of Star Citizen mopping up both negative and positive awards.) This year’s discussion on most anticipated was close too, but there’s more a sense of frustration since a lot of the games we’re picking from here year after year are the same – because they still aren’t out.

Don’t forget to cast your own vote in the just-for-fun reader poll at the very end!

The Massively OP staff pick for Most Anticipated MMORPG of 2018 and Beyond is…

CROWFALL

Andrew Ross (@dengarsw): Crowfall. Persistent “lobby” with instanced campaigns, non-standard crafting system, and pulling back on the race/class locking? Yes please! Runner up- Maguss! Surprise surprise, it’s an AR game. Readers keep saying good things despite the game being half a year late with its open beta. I know more AR fans probably want to see Harry Potter: Wizards Unite come out first, but Maguss seems more, well, MMO-like. POGO barely makes the “MMO” cut around here, and probably more thanks to Raph Koster’s comments than its game design, or at least in my opinion. Having an online mode paired with meatspace play helps!

Brendan Drain (@nyphur): Has to still be Star Citizen.

Brianna Royce (@nbrianna): Ug, I have so many. Camelot Unchained, of course, because RvR and crafting and no grinding and a great studio. Crowfall, which I backed, is totally back on my radar thanks to its huge overhauls this year that, well, make the game more an MMORPG than a glorified MOBA. Ascent: Infinite Realm and New World are the bigguns waiting in the wings, and I bet they start making these lists more consistently in 2018 and 2019. WoW Classic even has my attention; I’m not sure I’ll like it, but I can’t think why I wouldn’t at least give it a go for the nostalgia factor. Plus there’s Dual Universe and Project Gorgon and Sea of Thieves and all the superhero indies (Ship of Heroes will probably hit first?). I’d be pretty content if any of these took home the title.

Eliot Lefebvre (@Eliot_Lefebvre): Ascent: Infinite Realm. This game came out of nowhere, huh? But boy, steampunky airships with giant robots and such are my jam. So, yeah, I’m looking forward to this one, even knowing that I may wind up being disappointed by it when it finally finishes baking. Runners-up: Peria Chronicles and Crowfall.

Justin Olivetti (@Sypster): Ashes of Creation. There are concerns, chief among them has been the spotty dev updates over the years. But I am impressed with the vision of this title and what’s been presented so far. It’s a wide tent with a lot of room for different playstyles beneath it, so I hope that there will be room for me when it eventually does come out.

Larry Everett (@Shaddoe): I’m still looking to Crowfall. And most recently, the Star Wars Galaxies-like crafting really gives me high hopes for the game. I will not be able to actually jump into it until next year, but I am most looking forward to jumping into that over any other game that will release in the future.

MJ Guthrie (@MJ_Guthrie): I have two games that are tied for most anticipated: Rend and Dual Universe. Dual Universe looks like it could be what we hoped Landmark would be – a creative voxel sandbox experience that is all tied together in one world. And then it goes way beyond that! I mean, you can craft a ship out of voxels, put an engine in it, and blast off into space and fly to another planet. As for Rend, I am actually excited for a PvP game – that’s saying something. It looks beautiful, and it has exploration, building, pets… all without the FFA PvP that just brings out the worst in folks. Yes, I am very much looking forward to both of these games.

Tina Lauro Pollock (@purpletinabeans): I am thoroughly torn between Crowfall and WoW Classic and cannot pick a clear winner and runner up. I’ll be playing both! I am super duper excited for the crafting in Crowfall and I have my rose-tinted glasses on for Classic already.

Crowfall won our award for Most Anticipated MMORPG of 2018 and Beyond. What’s your pick? Do note that for this poll, you can choose up to three winners!

Reader poll: Which MMORPG is your most anticipated for 2018 and beyond?

  • Crowfall (13%, 364 Votes)
  • Star Citizen (7%, 197 Votes)
  • WoW Classic (10%, 295 Votes)
  • Ashes of Creation (6%, 177 Votes)
  • Camelot Unchained (10%, 288 Votes)
  • Ascent Infinite Realm (2%, 53 Votes)
  • Dual Universe (7%, 207 Votes)
  • Rend (0%, 10 Votes)
  • Peria Chronicles (1%, 20 Votes)
  • Project Gorgon (2%, 70 Votes)
  • Maguss (0%, 2 Votes)
  • Sea of Thieves (1%, 43 Votes)
  • New World (1%, 23 Votes)
  • City of Titans (1%, 36 Votes)
  • Valiance Online (1%, 15 Votes)
  • Ship of Heroes (1%, 24 Votes)
  • Bless (2%, 52 Votes)
  • Shroud of the Avatar (13%, 387 Votes)
  • Worlds Adrift (0%, 5 Votes)
  • Pantheon (5%, 144 Votes)
  • Legends of Aria (1%, 29 Votes)
  • Lost ARK (1%, 40 Votes)
  • Project TL aka The Lineage aka Lineage Eternal (0%, 10 Votes)
  • Chronicles of Elyria (3%, 94 Votes)
  • Wild West Online (1%, 20 Votes)
  • Monster Hunter World (1%, 42 Votes)
  • Moonlight Blade (0%, 10 Votes)
  • Red Dead Redemption 2 (1%, 24 Votes)
  • Conan Exiles (0%, 10 Votes)
  • Ultima Online F2P (1%, 24 Votes)
  • Skull and Bones (0%, 1 Votes)
  • Dauntless (0%, 11 Votes)
  • Anthem (1%, 28 Votes)
  • Soulworker Online (0%, 5 Votes)
  • The Crew 2 (0%, 10 Votes)
  • Cryptic's unnamed MTG MMORPG (1%, 19 Votes)
  • Darkfall New Dawn (1%, 30 Votes)
  • Ever, Jane (0%, 9 Votes)
  • Nothing (2%, 50 Votes)
  • Something else (tell us in the comments) (1%, 19 Votes)

Total Voters: 2,237

Loading ... Loading ...
Poll options include all games nominated plus other games we thought would be worthy.

MOP’S 2017 AWARDS (SO FAR)
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jammaplaya
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jammaplaya

So much anger against an amazing game like SotA. Some very sad people around here.

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Sulfurblade

https://www.traviangames.com/en/

Right here you see Travian is indeed the publisher for both!

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Sulfurblade

@Alleine

You are aware that Crowfall and Sota are partners?!? There both based in Austin, they share the same publisher etc etc….

Sadly neither Crowfall or Sota are living up to my expectations but Crowfall is a bit closer to the mark and far less of its content is hidden behind Paywalls!

tinnis_
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tinnis_

false: they are not professionally or financially connected…

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Alleine Dragonfyre

I wonder how well this Crowfall (whose graphics aren’t really that impressive from a glance) would have done in this poll if it wasn’t splattered all over the top before we actually scrolled down about 5 mousewheels to the poll. Hmmm…

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temp starcitizen

you think people can be manipulated into voting because your game didn’t win? thank you for the laughs.

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Victor Didra

Maybe I’m misreading it, but it looks like Shroud won to me.

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postlarval

In the space of an hour or two, 300 people voted for Shroud, hence the comment in the final results article.

This isn’t the first time Portalarium and SotA’s community has tried to manipulate the perception of the game. Steam *cough cough* Steam.

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Paulie Walnuts

Manipulate the perception of the game… It’s a poll. The whole point is for people to vote. It’s sole purpose is to gauge interest and popularity.

It doesn’t matter if Port promoted it or not. It’s no different than a political candidate going around the country campaigning for votes.

Do you honestly think those candidates don’t vote for themselves? Do you honestly think they don’t ask people to vote for them?

Too funny.

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Victor Didra

That’s not true, it crawled up neck and neck with Crowfall over the last couple of days. Yeah, it was a big surprise to everyone that we won, but it was linked in game and in the forums, and we’ve got a lot more than 300 players who show up for our monthly telethons, so not unrealistic.

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Ben Parry

Shroud of the Avatar all the way. Been playing now for 1 year and a few months. Most the negative people here don’t play or have only played very little. The game has a lot to offer from interesting story concept, biggest housing concept since UO, Classless system be what you want, amazing crafting system, Lots of armor types, lots of guilds, Trader companies, Hard dungeons and bosses, 3 modes of play (single player, friends only online, and standard online) As to steam comments below that is opinion not fact. I have a SOTA account that was Steam linked. I do not use steam to play, but log in directly using their client. Why because it seemed to get the updates faster. I’m part of an active guild and never not had someone to play. addicting this is. If you played UO or into games like it this will peak your interest. Development has been ramping up fast and polishing is where things are at. the next few months before release are optimizations and content (quests, and zone upgrades). Look forward to Chapter 2 next year (Boats, Oceans, Pirates, sea monsters, ship 2 ship combat and new lands). Can’t wait until release :)

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temp starcitizen

Boats, Oceans, Pirates, sea monsters, ship 2 ship combat? You do realize those mechanics aren’t promised anywhere, that’s from a wishful thoughts list. They’re still trying to deliver on promises from Kickstarter.

I wouldn’t expect much even if they do stay open long enough to create an epsisode 2. They don’t even have mounts yet, or mounted combat and you honestly believe they’re going to produce ship 2 ship combat? You do realize they give players coconuts so their toons can play pretend to be on mounts, because mounts tech is too complicated for them to implement? Keep drinking the koolaids, meanwhile I’ll be waiting for the game to go full on free-to-play.

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Paulie Walnuts

Waiting, and hating whenever you can find the opportunity. I’d love to see you wait and not say anything at all.

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temp starcitizen

Waiting and hating? no way. But I am waiting to see if anyone gets a onion router or VPN and pushes Skull and Bones into the lead, they only get 1 vote. that’s sad.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

You need to look inward to figure out why that’s happening. Perhaps some silent meditation.

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Ben Parry

Actually those were from the telethon where they were talking about chapter 2 and what is coming. its not a wish list. I can tell you do not attended the live streams or Q&A sessions where they discuss up coming things, as well go through the player questions.

There is no mounts short of coconuts as you said. I believe they mentioned that in the telethons or Q&A sessions that there would be none this release.

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temp starcitizen

Nope, those are from their wish list – check the forums and you’ll see devs reminding everyone that those ideas are not promised but just fun things they’d like to implement someday maybe. I do watch the livestreams but no as much since they turned them into stretch goal telethons. They used to have a monthly stream when they talk about the game but now all they do is talk a little about new decorations and then spin a wheel for what goes on a flash sale.

If you like shopping and collecting and emotes, you probably like Shroud very much. They keep saying they will do great things so I keep waiting but I won’t be blind to what I see and experience, like 12 fps and 2 minutes loading in a scene. That is real too.

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Paulie Walnuts

They do non telethon streams every Friday now. Tune in at 4. If you’re getting 12 fps that’s on you and your rig. Average is 30-60 with machines in spec. Same thing with load times, 10-15 seconds for machines in spec.

As for the wish list… yes they have things on wish lists, but the stuff mentioned above is actually on the plan. If you want to go down the no guarantee route, nothing is guaranteed. Their building could blow up tomorrow and end it all.

This response confirms you’re living in a sour past experience because none of it is accurate.

So just keep waiting, but consider just waiting and not blowing smoke.

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temp starcitizen

“Average is 30-60 with machines in spec. Same thing with load times, 10-15 seconds for machines in spec”

proof? I know this is what their dev Chris says is average, but there is no proof… Only players complaining and experiencing long load times, crashes, and very low fps – sometimes fps is below 10. If you are in multiplayer and in a party or just in a scene with other players you will have low fps and lag. That is a fact that can be watched on any stream. If you have proof otherwise, show me. Why don’t you stream it live for everyone to see – then the world will know how honest and true you are.

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Paulie Walnuts

I’m speaking from experience on 3 different machines of 3 different specs. One of which that barely makes the cut. I would also say guesstimating 90% of the people I have spoken to with machines in spec have confirmed. I don’t know what you need for proof, but I can’t go back in time and do a stream side by side to compare, so I guess you’re just going to take me for my word.

Try turning the shadows off and see if that helps at all. There’s historically been a problem with Unity and shaders causing massive FPS drops for people.

If it’s any consolation, i’m not a fanboy. This game and development team has pissed me off many times. I’m even taking a small hiatus right now myself as I have been going hard for over a year.

I don’t have a problem with people not liking the game. To each their own, really. I’m not telling you to like it. What I do have a problem with is people spreading bogus information all over the place and trying to ruin the experience for other people before they even get started.

EDIT: Also, if you’re expecting to run Ultra settings on a less than optimal PC and get over 15FPS, you’re just fooling yourself.

Put everything on fastest and reassess.

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temp starcitizen

30 fps is nothing. Anyone with a min spec machine should be able to pull 30 fps on the game’s highest most beautiful setting with all lighting maxed out. If I’m turning everything down to speed settings, I should be getting 80+ fps because then we’re into competition MMO fighting.

I have a high end machine with dual GPUs and without going full nerd on you, let’s just say that it’s blazing. On speed settings I can’t get 20 fps. The noob areas are optimized and devs hang out in there to tweak settings to make the noob experience better. Good for them, it helps sink the hook.

The game is not optimized and throwing out random quotes that fps is 30-60 is just not true. The noob areas are the most optimized in the game and they’re barely seeing 30 fps when you stand still in front of a tree.

Game needs to be optimized, the decorations need optimizations and lots of work done to all LoD. Shaders, mats, and textures need to be more uniform instead of all over the place. You and the dragon lady are trolling me hard and insisting I hate the game, not true. I don’t hate it, but I would like to see it reach some minimum play standards so people could give it fair reviews. Right now, it’s not good. My machine can run Star Citizen on the highest settings and I get better fps there than I do in this Unity project.

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Paulie Walnuts

I agree, the game still needs more optimization. By all means feel free to go full nerd. I’m running an I7-6600k overclocked to 4.2 Ghz, GeForce 1070, and 16 gig of Crucial RAM. On full ultra settings, yes, I see frame drops and I agree It should be a lot higher than what I get, especially in large NPC towns. But simply put, your claims of 15FPS I call bullshit on. Are you talking 15-20 frames consistently? Or are you just mad because you dip that low occasionally? Some people are real sticklers on FPS and freak out over the littlest things that wouldn’t even phase your average casual gamer. Which are you?

You’re challenging me to create a video to prove you wrong. So you’re telling me if I were to take the time and create a video of me playing between 30-60FPS in populated areas with heavy combat, that you would admit it’s your rig and your problem and not 100% the terrible games fault?

In return, I would challenge you to show me that you’re running at 15-20 frames with your system specs, because i’m not buying what you’re selling here.

What are the rules of the stream?

I’m not trolling you. I’m pointing out your inconsistencies and critiquing your critique. You say you don’t hate the game, and maybe you don’t. But look at your comments. Do you think anyone is really out of line for assuming that you do?

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Paulie Walnuts

Also, maybe your dual GPU is part of the problem?

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Paulie Walnuts

You know what, I forgot I had this. Here’s a video from 10 months ago when the games optimization was complete crap. I was doing a serpent run to show a buddy how to grind for in game gold. I stayed pretty consistent at 50+ frames while doing this run.

Mind you, the game has been optimized 10x what it was at this time in both graphics and performance.

Does this suffice?

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temp starcitizen

Hahahahaha, you’re in SPO mode. Playing SOLO you had better get more than 30 fps! Do you even know how the network architecture on this game behaves? I don’t think so – and that is why it is necessary to test your fps in MMO mode. It is a MMO! If more than say 5 players can’t be in a party and in a scene because it’s too much strain on the services then everything needs to be reworked.

Put 10 people in Blood Bay and fight. Oh wait, you can’t do that because you will lag out and because your fps is so bad you will die and you don’t even know where the hits are coming from.

I’m sorry, but no. This will not suffice.

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Paulie Walnuts

You keep siting network when referring to FPS. Yet you stated earlier that I don’t know how FPS works. It seems you’re the one confused here. Network connectivity has nothing to do with FPS. So I’m not even sure what we’re talking about anymore.

Just happened to stumble across the video sitting here at work and thought I’d toss it out there since you’re all over the place in this discussion.

It sounds like you’re looking for someone in a party of 5+ people fighting things with smooth gameplay. Stop using the term FPS if you’re just referring to smooth gameplay. There’s a lot more to it than just FPS. You’re talking about a combination of things here. Primarily the illusion of FPS drops due to latency issues.

For someone who didn’t want to get all “nerdy” on me earlier, I’m beginning to wonder just how nerdy you actually are.

Are you saying you get smooth gameplay when you play solo? If so, unless I missed it, that would have been great to know a long time ago when you were blanket spewing your FPS flaws all over the place.

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temp starcitizen

The game has skill based combat, yes? It has PVP, yes? It is a MMO, yes? All this means that what you see on the screen needs to be accurate to what you do in combat is correct.

30fps is minimum standard to see a nice game and enjoy it but it only minimum standard and this is only true in the noob areas. 60fps is minimum for skill based combat. The game server doesn’t do all the AI, that is handed off to other players and when the performance drops. So when your in SOLO game mode, all the AI is on your machine so you are not affected by the network and your framerate will remain accurate at 30fps or more. When you are in Multi you’re affected by other players for AI and RNG and the game tries to sync everyone for smooth gameplay which translates to highest frame rates possible – in many cases that means low fps less than 30 – mostly around 20 or less.

Even Netflix you want 48-60fps for a good experience. But when combat is dependent on it, all that lag and low fps make the game just a turd. They need to fix all the problems so everyone can have 60fps in any scene in the game in multiplayer for acceptable combat. Bad services affect fps and game experience in this game. The fps is too low for multiplayer. In SOLO, ok, you can play but who wants to play a MMO in SOLO mode? That is just stupid.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

Dragonlady, eh? I like it! It implies strength fortified by fear. I’ll take it as a compliment.
Dude, I’m not trolling you. I’m making counterpoints. That’s the basis for a discussion. Are you here to discuss or just trash the game?

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Bill Baker

dude… you are seriously on crack

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Alleine Dragonfyre
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temp starcitizen

THANK YOU!

” Please note that none of these are committed features and none of these have final designs of any kind. This is just a very early draft that is the result of some quick brainstorms and ideas we accumulated when we are not crazy busy trying to finish Episode 1.”

It says the disclaimer right at the top of the post you linked. Do you see it now? It is just a wishes list.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

Nowhere in that statement does it say wish list. It says ” very early draft.”

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Bwahahahaha. If you think the two are different, I have a bridge to sell you. Don’t you GET the Shroud devs have been stringing people along for years? During the beg-a-thons they say YES! to just about any hairbrained idea, because they know if people think stuff is still coming, they’ll keep throwing money at them? Anyone can see some of this stuff is pure fantasyland, given the way it’s taken them 4 years and they still don’t have a very basic MMO sorted out.

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the_balance

SOTA already launched, in August of 2016 as discussed extensively and agreed upon by nearly every writer that’s mentioned it on this website. It’s inclusion here is humorous, at best.

You use the word concept a lot for a game that, at its “official” launch, will need to use these concepts to convince new players over a year behind in progress that its worth trying to catch up in a heavily instanced game with a minimal player population.

Development has been ramping up fast? What are you basing this statement on? What’s increased or been implemented in a fashion “faster” then before. The game was supposed to officially “launch” last year and was delayed. Failing to adhere to self-imposed deadlines is basically the antitheses of fast development.

The UI is unacceptably bad. The graphics look like a game from a decade ago. The mechanics behind combat are ridiculous, convoluted, and bad. Watching the combat is boring and as anti-climactic as I’ve ever seen in an RPG that wasn’t turn based.

There’s very little to point at in SOTA and present as a positive. And before you try the, “People who haven’t played” comment, I’m the only person who wrote guides for this game when it went persistent (see also – launched) in 2016 and had them featured on Steam and promoted by Port themselves. I know the game quite well, and there’s a reason I no longer play it. It’s bad, and they haven’t done anything to convince me that they’re capable of making good decisions from the end of 2016 forward.

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Paulie Walnuts

I do find it amusing that the “year behind in progress” and the “only 200 active players” is used quite a bit in the same breath.

“Development has been ramping up fast? What are you basing this statement on?”

All documented… Game optimization (FPS and load times 30-60 FPS pretty much guaranteed on healthy machines in spec, and 10-15 second load times on 90% of the scenes down from 30-90 seconds), content (many stories, scenes, animations, skills and combat have been updated heavily), and nearing launch marketing and promotion will go into effect. I have screenshots of 6 months ago that i can lay side by side with current screenshots and the visuals alone are night and day.

“The game was supposed to officially “launch” last year and was delayed.”

Everyone in the community agreed that was the best move. No one expected that deadline to be met with the condition the game was in.

“Failing to adhere to self-imposed deadlines is basically the antitheses of fast development.”

From a pessimistic attitude, sure. I don’t know about you, but i’m sick of developers releasing supposed full polished games before they should. I can get behind missing a self-imposed deadline for the greater good.

“And before you try the, “People who haven’t played” comment, I’m the only person who wrote guides for this game when it went persistent (see also – launched) in 2016 and had them featured on Steam and promoted by Port themselves.”

I’m going to go there anyway… 2016? Come on.

If you don’t like the game, that’s fine. I can respect that. I’m not saying that you should. I’m just answering your questions and saying it’s not all doom and gloom for everyone.

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temp starcitizen

I would still like to see any proof from any player that can get the load times and fps that you say is average. I don’t believe it, I can’t believe it because I have a new machine that will blow the door off their spec and cannot get even 20 fps. If you can or you know someone that streams in MMO mode with other players and can get more than 10 fps you should link their stream right now.

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Paulie Walnuts

I literally just searched Twitch.tv for “shroud of the avatar” and found this guy streaming. Looks fine to me.

https://www.twitch.tv/mightywrath

You could have done that and the fact that you’ve put no effort into it speaks volumes.

And guess what… It’s his first time playing having a great time.

Will you even take the time to watch? Curious to read your response.

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temp starcitizen

You don’t understand what fps is, do you. he’s just streaming the game, and he could be playing solo or in offline mode. He does not show any fps and no one can see his load times until he cycles the scene. That will change for the mode he is in so it is important to be in some sort of control group. You must have your mode set to multiplayer you you must be in a group and have a tool to display your fps accurately. Just because you think it looks good doesn’t mean anything. Higher fps is important for combat and very important in pvp. So maybe your test should be for a player in a PVP scene, that would also guarantee multiplayer mode and fighting against other players. Nice try though.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

You really do stretch to make your points don’t you?

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Paulie Walnuts

Dude, he’s clearly sitting there interacting with other people. You obviously didn’t watch the video and you’re beating a dead horse to save face.

I don’t understand FPS? Look, I don’t need a number in the top right corner to know that he’s not running at 15 FPS. That’s for people who don’t understand what FPS is. In fact, I could soundly say he’s running over 60FPS just by watching the stream.

I did exactly as you asked and you’re too proud to even consider the possibility that you’re wrong. At this point you’re just wasting my time.

If you’re that interested and need that much convincing, i’ll let you do your own search on twitch. You asked, you received, and now you’re going to take pot shots and “manipulate” the discussion to fit your agenda.

This will be my last comment with you. I’ll let the readers decide who’s being ridiculous here. It should be a no brainer.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

But you HATE the game. So why bother?

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Shroud of the Avatar… a game that promised a bunch of stuff at Kickstarter… turned into something else entirely… and is so underwhelming you can count the people playing, 500 days beyond persistence, in the hundreds.

There’s a push in this thread – architected on the official Shroud forums – to come over here and vote and basically monster people who think the game is awful and are happy to say so, so I simply ask people to do two things.

The first is consider the fact there are 60,000 game accounts and next to no one playing. What ‘the crowd’ does in any situation is usually a pretty good indicator.

But the second is, don’t just take anyone’s word for it. Download the free trial. See if it’s the worst game you’ve played in the 21st century, or see if there’s something to it. Only YOU will know for sure.

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Rudy Phillips

Shroud of the Avatar must of rounded up all 301 active players to come here and vote. The games a turd.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Agreed. And you know what? I’m actually glad there’s an ongoing free trial so that anyone who reads comments like this, or the one above it, is more then welcome to go and download the game. Try it! Please! Anyone who has played an MMO in the past decade… heck, even just a videogame in the past decade… will have no choice but to agree the game is terrible. It just doesn’t compete with what else is out there. Which begs an obvious question… where has all the money gone? Clearly not on this Unity asset store-bought landscape of tiny instances and horrible combat. It’s a dog.

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Paulie Walnuts

The game isn’t terrible. Plenty of people play the trial and buy the game. What made you so salty?

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Salty? LOL, when someone uses that term I know I’m dealing with a kid. So let’s stick to facts. No information supports what you’re saying AT ALL. Indeed, the one bit of information we have from Portalarium, re: the trial is that when it started, 1100 people tried it and 900 gave up before two hours had elapsed. And that’s what they were willing to say publicly.

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Paulie Walnuts

A kid? That’s your problem. You think you know what you’re talking about. I’m not the one laying on the ground throwing a tantrum, kid.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Yeah… right… I’m posting links to the facts I’m stating while you rave like a maniac with absolutely no back up and, in your mind, I’m the one throwing a tantrum? It would be funny, if it wasn’t so tragic.

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Paulie Walnuts

Throwing facts? More like smoking cracks. You’re an embarrassment to the haters.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Right… so a direct link to the official Shroud forum… to a Shroud developer’s post… is “smoking crack”. I see. I think that, in a nutshell, shows how desperate the Shroud cultists are at this point in time. Thanks for helping me to highlight it.

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Paulie Walnuts

I’ve already replied to that BS comment. You’re not fooling anyone.

shibby523
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shibby523

Give it up. They can’t post facts that make this game look good. They don’t exist.

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Ben Parry

opinion not fact Raleigh, as well you stated you don’t even play. your just Trolling at this point.

Solaris
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Solaris

He’s trolling. Don’t feed the troll!?

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Yes, posting facts from Shrouds own devs… trolling. Uh huh. Seems that if someone says something a Shroud cultist doesn’t like, it’s “trolling” – even when it’s 100% factual.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Sorry, Ben? You can go to Chris’ dev diary and see where he mentioned 1100 people tried it and 900 gave up before two hours had elapsed. Actually, sod this, I’m absolutely sick to death of people saying stuff is “opinion” when it’s actually fact. So here’s the link: https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/chris-daily-work-blog.85584/ and see the entry for 4/10. Any comebacks to that? Hopefully not, although I never put it past a Shroud cultist to say something ridiculous in the face of facts.

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Paulie Walnuts

To be fair, trial accounts are heavily limited, so there’s really no reason to play a trial account longer than 2 hours. Also, there’s no mention of how many of those trial accounts were converted into full blown accounts before reaching two hours. Nowhere does he say “they quit”.

Seems you’re just as guilty of what you’re “sick to death” of.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

If anyone reading this thinks of other PC game trials they’ve played – and were enjoying – did they stop under two hours and conclude, “Well, that’s enough for me!” No, I think we all know the answer to that question. Frankly, you’re clutching at straws and trying to imagine things that might make the situation sound better. Note that key word: imagine. Me? I’m not imagining anything; I’m reporting what a Shroud dev actually said. Have a nice day.

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Paulie Walnuts

Yeah, I’m the one making a grab at straws. You’re spinning context and making assumptions. That’s all you’re doing.

My day just keeps getting better.

shibby523
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shibby523

Does not meant they didn’t. Anyone that buys the game from Ports site is an idiot. You can buy from Steam and get a 2 hour or 2 week refund if you don’t like the game. A Port account, you’d have to go through the trouble to RMT the account.

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Paulie Walnuts

“You can buy from Steam and get a 2 hour or 2 week refund if you don’t like the game.”

That’s a lot different than permanently having the option to invest into and sell the account by not going through steam. If my account wasn’t attached to steam I could sell it on paypal right now for about 2000$+

But I’m stuck with it unless I want to sell my entire steam account + library. If anything, I’m worse off going through steam if I ever wanted to get my investment back.

To call someone an idiot for making that decision is just silly.

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Victor Didra

Yes, he did say that.

Last April.

Which is why we now have the 3 Outskirts new player areas, tons more quests, and astronomically better tutorials (with more coming this release according to Starr, in today’s live stream.)

I was there for the whole thing, and could have lost my mind thinking they sucked for the first few releases, for each Outskirts map. But now it’s been months of work, they are solid and I would wager they’ve got a much higher retention rate now.

Which is kinda the point of that whole blog post. “We’ve gotta fix this, so here we go!”

solazur
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solazur

Salty is a kids term now? Who knew? Heck, I remember that as a term from my childhood which started during Eisenhower’s 1st term in office.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

If you can’t see the irony in what you just wrote…

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Alex Hoggett

I mean it took them forever but it’s actually getting alot better in the last couple months. It still needs some help, but uh, so do all of these options. When was the last time you actually logged in and played it ?

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

My last login and playtime doesn’t matter as I watch livestreams of several different people who play the game. These are people wildly passionate about it, and who play A LOT. So I get a pretty good look at how it’s faring. And I still don’t like what I see. It’s clunky and amateurish and nothing like what most of the industry is producing. Other games are leaving SotA in their rearview mirrors and the SotA devs don’t seem to realise (or care?)

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Ben Parry

Lol, you are trying to compare industry titles that spend 100-200 million and have large development houses to a game that has so far produced an amazing game on15 million and around 20 developers. Compared to a lot of stuff out there this has some great stuff. Is it a AAA, not yet.

considering you have not played it and only watched videos why should anyone consider your thoughts in anything. You are simply being a troll because it does not display what you want to see in the videos :)

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

I knew as soon as you asked the question, Ben, what answer you were hoping for and would hammer on. Very obvious. I was happy to give a truthful answer, however, as anyone knows that watching hours and hours of people streaming the game is a pretty good way of seeing what a game is like. It is, after all, why streaming is so popular… or has that fact passed you by? Having played Shroud for years, until mid 2017, and watching streams since, I have a very, very, VERY good idea what the game is like. And it’s awful. Being called a troll for stating all of this just reflects negatively on you, honestly.

shibby523
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shibby523

Watching videos is one of my main ways to see if I’ll like a game that I’m on the fence about. Streamers are also a great source of info, if you need to know something and many are more than happy to answer questions.

Not sure why you’d say that someone can’t get an idea of a game from videos. Pure nonsense.

As one that has player SotA recently, it’s garbage. Of course that’s my opinion and the opinion of many others that I have talked to.

Just walking around in SotA you meet a plethora of very weird people. Just saying weird stuff. One person was trying to get me to log onto her Discord for a really great offer. I can only imagine she was heavily into RMT and thought I was a newb she could rip off on some good old Unity asset store purchased goods.

bubonichubris
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bubonichubris

They have about 40 developers. At least they used to the last time a developer told me how many people worked there.

shibby523
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shibby523

I’ve logged in within the last month and it’s still terrible.

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Ben Parry

Raleigh I agree people should try it and decide on their own then listen to opinions of others. Myself I love the game and the direction its going. Votes speak though, seems a lot of us like this. And don’t give me Bot BS that is simply not true.

Solaris
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Solaris

Your opinion isn’t everone’s. That’s where your arguments fail miserably.

I’ve been playing SotA for a couple of years. Heavily over the last year. One of the best MMO communities I’ve been a part of. Incredible housing and customization. Some fantastic questing. Perfect, no. Good online RPG, yes.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Indeed my opinion isn’t everyone’s. However we can point to the fact there are 60,000 game accounts out there, yet only a few hundred people playing the game, over 500 days beyond persistence. Seems more than a few people might share my opinion. So to say they “fail miserably”… no. The numbers really bear out my POV no matter how much that might trigger you.

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michael henderson

I’ve tinkered with SOTA a bit, and this is my honest opinion. The concept is fantastic, but the execution is poor. They didn’t do well with the world map design, and the instancing constantly is more annoying than FFXIV, which I didn’t think was possible. The graphics are ok for an unpolished game, but models won’t get polished because they couldn’t even bother to design their own models. These are all pre-fabs I’ve seen before on 3D modeling purchase sites. The combat is boring, I like the system, but not the execution. The game is NOT new user friendly, I’m lucky I’ve played tons of MMORPGs and already grasped the basic concepts. The performance is atrocious!! I’m not on a high end gaming machine, but my laptop can run WOW on high in AV, and FFXIV on max graphics. SOTA should not be an issue….

I wanted to love this game, I really did. I longed for a 3D version of UO. At this point Richard Garriot is a huge disappointment and I’ve lost all faith in him. The game is still not “officially” launched, it’s backed by $12 million USD, and it’s still a cash grab. Seriously, anything worth having is for sale. Want a house? No problem! Just give us more money! I feel like they are taking advantage of faithful fans and riding the hype train all the way to the bank! There is not $12 million worth of design and optimization. Maybe $750K based on employee salaries and the purchase of literally every model in the game. Has anyone noticed that they are running a stock server side solution with the engine backend? That’s why they instance towns, because they have no idea how to properly expand the map, which I can do in like 3 hours of work… but why bother? People love instances! /sarcasm

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Paulie Walnuts

I agree with most everything here. But i haven’t lost faith, and I am optimistic for the future. I don’t think the funds are preventing the optimisation and design. I think it’s the team size. They should bring on more people, and by the sounds of it you could be a part of that solution. If you could fix the instance thing in 3 hours of work, you should apply. You’d be a savior all sarcasm aside.

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michael henderson

I was actually considering working for Blizzard Entertainment as a software engineer, but then I remembered I liked being retired and watching my kids grow up. I was an infantryman in the Army, so deployment schedule over, I’m going to be home. My degree can remain useless garbage…

solazur
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solazur

With all due respect, when I read comments that would infer expertise, like the ability to fix the map in 3 hours coupled with math that has a crew of 30ish working for 5 years for $750k it kinda detracts from ye olde credibility.

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michael henderson

Wait… they have 30 devs and that’s the crap they churned out in 5 years? Jesus, it’s worse than I thought…. I did have hope and now it’s gone.

Oh and FYI: modern mapping and environment tools do infact make it possible to create a few unpopulated zones in a few hours. Look at that portion of some other mmo engines. Now I’m not familiar with their particular engine, but why would anyone choose anything these days not geared toward rapid development?

Here’s hoping EA finally makes a UO2, because RG sure can’t….

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puzzled

That’s what they always do. No one will play that turd of a game so the couple hundred people they do have try to manipulate the polls to win.

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temp starcitizen

They know how to manipulate their players – they even asked for positive Steam reviews, though that blew up in their face. Imagine how horrible their Steam rating would be if they weren’t asking for good reviews.

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Ben Parry

Not sure what your 3 issues are, the game is pretty good. They do not pay people to post nothing, people will vote for what they like. just because you disagree or don’t like the game does not mean that everyone else has the same views.

As to numbers Rudy, that is opinion not fact ;)

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Paulie Walnuts

Manipulate their players. Yeah, they’re holding guns to people’s heads and saying, “Give us positive reviews or else.”

You guys are so caught up in the hate for some reason that you’re living in an alternate reality.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

I’m feeling SUPER manipulated…almost like I have no free will at all…. OMG MY HAND IS MOVING THE MOUSE TO THE VOTE FOR SHROUD BUTTON. MAKE IT STOP!!!!!1111

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KABALYERO

hahahaha… nice Alleine… I’m super manipulated too… LOL… these allegations are so ridiculous… Star Citizen manipulated me too and Dual Universe… they made me vote for them… LOL

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Paulie Walnuts

Jesus. Well, if the other games are so great, and so much better, then surely they will have more than 300 fans to come save the day from the big bad cheaters.

shibby523
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shibby523

Why are there only a handful of you here to defend this ohh so mighty game? This is the usual SotA crap anytime a poll comes up somewhere, it gets posted on the forums and the VPN’ers come out in droves if they are able to abuse the voting system. Trust me not many people are voting for SotA legitimately.

Thing is SotA was (i believe) 3rd in the polls for most likely to fail.

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Paulie Walnuts

Not sure what you expect here in response. It’s not an “ohh so mighty game”. I defend it because I like it and because a lot of the allegations that are constantly levied against it are abhorrently false. I’m the first to agree when someone points out the legitimate issues. I just have a low tolerance for people who craft stories to support their biased opinions. That’s not limited to this game, that’s in general.

shibby523
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shibby523

Can’t say I’ve seen false allegations thrown at the game. It has earned and usually everything is backed up by links to proof or lots of time wayback machine because of Ports penchant to delete anything that highlights the issues with the game.

If a company deletes all valid criticism then it’s done for only one reason. They don’t want the truth to be known and want the forums looking like roses so they can sucker people into buying the game.

They have even said they only want positive posts on the forums. That is messed up, yeah nothing to hide there.

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Paulie Walnuts

“If a company deletes all valid criticism”

This is exactly what I’m talking about. They don’t delete all valid criticism. They delete threads that get out of control (or are out of control from the start) and turn personal and nasty. Unfortunately, that’s the fault of both sides. The radical believers and the radical haters.

I can’t honestly sit here and act like there’s never been anything removed that maybe shouldn’t have, just as much as you can’t honestly sit there and claim they delete ALL valid criticism.

Furthermore, when they say they want only positive posts, the people who are mad will automatically assume that means to only say good things about the game. When in actuality it means if you’re going to criticise, do it with a little professionalism and offer something more than just a childish rant.

It’s a matter of perspective, and some people only see red.

bubonichubris
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bubonichubris

They also lock threads with no valid reason or explanation. Like this one, linking to the other poll “most likely to flop”. No forum rules broken, no explanation, just locked and closed.

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/most-likely-to-flop.107066/

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Alleine Dragonfyre

I highlight stuff all the time that needs improvement or change and no one is deleting me.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

Pretty sure most other games did that too. Also, notice the big Crowfall plug at the top. That’s “super fair and not influential at all.”

Solaris
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Solaris

Pantheon and Camelot Unchained.

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Ben Parry

those both look good.

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Zeewyr

CU for me

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temp starcitizen

At first I couldn’t believe that Shroud of the Avatar could get any votes, but then I saw they are promoting voting. https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/massively-ops-most-anticipated-mmorpg-of-2018-voting-now-open-shroud-of-the-avatar-nominated.107415/ They should win for sure.

deekay_plus
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Patreon Donor
deekay_plus

Crowfall wins MassivelyOP most anticipated award 2017 from MMORPG

crowfall subreddit also has (more understandably) linked this article XD

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temp starcitizen

What is the most anticipated MMORPG for you? from shroudoftheavatar

Shroud’s subreddit has a thread going to, but I think the redditors want camelot unchained or ashes of creation.

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Kickstarter Donor
Phubarrh

Right, somebody tell me it’s worth playing now? I’ve bounced off the trial a number of times.

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temp starcitizen

Good luck finding someone with something overall good to say about the game, I’m just saying since they’re officially pushing the community to vote in this poll they will probably win. Even though no one plays the game, they have like 250k forum members.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

I’m someone that has many, many good things to say about the game.

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Victor Didra

I’m a big fan, playing right now as a matter of fact! Time to go water the cotton.

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Paulie Walnuts

” Even though no one plays the game, they have like 250k forum members.” Almost sounds oxymoronic doesn’t it? Funny thing is there has been little promotion for this game at all and it’s considered a threat. Imagine what it’s going to be like when Portalarium really starts promoting and marketing the game outside of their forums.

I would say overall it’s a pretty solid game with a very bright future ahead of it in terms of development commitment. Does it have its flaws? Absolutely. Is it perfect? No. But how common is that with games that are early in the stages of their official release? Pretty common even for big titles and companies.

Some people have a big problem with how long it has taken to get where it is today. I counter that with pointing out that patience is a virtue, and this game is all about virtues.

Here’s a few things you should consider before playing Shroud of the Avatar:

Portalarium is a small development team in the grand scheme of things, but they are not short on creativity and a community full of players with great ideas and participation for future updates.

The game has been developed over the course of 4 years on a shoestring budget compared to other companies putting out quality MMORPGS. All things considered (size of team and funds), this game has come a very long way from the beginning, especially over the last 3-6 months. They have listened to the community quite a bit.

This game is not easy. It’s complex, it’s frustrating to play alone, and it’s a slow burn even after you establish some friends and start making your way through developing your character. It takes commitment and time investment to really start appreciating everything this game has to offer. My advice… Find people, make friends, ask for help, and don’t give up.

Everything in this game has real life monetary value and Portalarium supports you capitalising off of it. This is huge if you need a little incentive to grind just a little more or to adventure and take more risks than you normally would in other MMORPGS. There’s real reward for playing this game and I find that to be one of the most appealing aspects.

There is a cash shop to buy material items in the game. Some people look down on this as a money grab or a “Pay to Win” option, but it’s ultimately not unless you look at real estate as your sole marker for your goal/status in the game. Most of what you can buy in the add-on store for real cash you can also buy in game with currency you can obtain through good old fashioned hard work. Nothing that you can buy with cash (with the exception of housing) is much more than cosmetic and won’t contribute much to getting a head start over anyone else in the character development.

If you keep these things in mind when you begin a character in Shroud of the Avatar, you will be much better off and should be on your way to enjoying the game for what it is if it’s your style.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

The 250k forum members have huge slabs of bots, dead accounts, etc, from a time when the forum was open and not locked down. The real figures that people should care about are (a) How many people OWN the game? Portalarium puts this around 60k and, (b) How many people actually PLAY the game? Anyone can access the Steam charts and see the figure is in the HUNDREDS. Even if we generously double it to account for people using the shoddy launcher alternative to Steam, it’s under 1000 people. Terrible game.

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Paulie Walnuts

Steam isn’t the only way to login, so those metrics are a guesstimate at best. Huge slabs of bots? Where’s the evidence? Dead accounts… I can agree with that.

1k+ people playing a game that’s in beta with no promotion for 3 years isn’t too shabby.

Just because you don’t like the game doesn’t make it terrible. Get over yourself.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

LOL… Steam is the PREMIER way to log in, so I’m actually being quite generous doubling the Steam figures… and even when I do that the figures are still seriously, terribly, embarrassingly, laughably BAD.

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Ben Parry

why do you care so much about trolling SOTA? You said yourself up there that you don’t play it, but you watch videos on it and feel the need to be negative because its getting so many votes? If you don’t plan on playing then why are you so concerned to make it known to people that you don’t like a game you don’t intend to play and don’t even play? perhaps you are paid by someone to post negative things seeing there would be no other reason for you to be trolling :) just saying…

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temp starcitizen

So having an opinion is now trolling? Most of the time creating faslehoods to develop a false narrative is trolling. I am critical of SOTA because I try to play, key word is try. They took all the monies, but we get a weak Unity project in return and it is painful to play, it is even painful to watch other people play it on Twitch with all the lag and bugs and crashes.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Yeah, although I will make a slight tweak to that, temp, it’s having an opinion (that triggers the fans) is now trolling. Doesn’t matter how factual it is. Like how I was pointing to comments, by Shroud devs, on the official Shroud forum, and because it was triggering them, I got a chrous of “troll” shouted at me. It would be hilarious if it wasn’t so scary. These people are so welded to the game that they won’t even believe stuff on their own official forum, by their own devs, if it causes them discomfort and makes them think too much about how off-course the game is. That’s a really unhealthy way to be, period.

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Paulie Walnuts

Whatever dude. Keep attacking everyone to make yourself feel better. You linked something from the devs and spun it. Yes, the numbers were right, but the narrative was wrong.

You said 900 out of 1100 quit. The dev post said 900 or of 1100 didn’t make it passed 2 hours in trial status.

You’re assuming the ones that didn’t made it passed 2 hours quit. They could have purchased the game and went out of trial status before 2 hours.

And like i said before, trial accounts are so limited, there’s not much point to play much after the new trial user zone is complete.

Your point was garbage, still is.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

I do it to make myself feel better? Weird. I don’t think so at all, yet you seem to think you can make that diagnosis over the Internet. Do you really think you’re that prescient? Wow! How impressive!

I’ll simply repeat my motivation from elsewhere in this thread: I backed this game, at the time of Kickstarter, for a lot of money. Like many others (something which can be demonstrated via 60,000 game accounts and yet player figures are counted in the hundreds), I’m really disappointed with how it’s turned out – both in regard to what was promised at the time of Kickstarter and what it became… and also how the game plays in general. It’s very amateurish.

So call me names all you like (I really don’t care!), but from my POV I’ve backed this game heavier than the average punter, and I have opinions on it. It seems that stating an opinion that a Shroud cultist doesn’t like means being called a troll, no matter how factual the statements are. Such talk just makes you folk look silly and defensive but, as I keep saying, the real proof of the pudding is for anyone reading this to simply download the free trial and see for themself. Is it amateur hour or a really great game? They’ll soon find out.

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Paulie Walnuts

What do you expect people to conclude when you repeat the same thing every single time you post? Seriously.

Also, I never called you a troll or a name. I said you were an embarrassment to the haters in the face of you calling me a kid. I also have no problems with opinions. But like I’ve said before, I do have a problem with people making stuff up.

Coupling factual information with your own speculation then claiming it’s all fact is not fact. It’s that simple. If you want to drop factual information, fine. But don’t create your own narrative by adding your own details that don’t exist in the source you’re pointing to. That’s mainly what I’m trying to get through to you. Because when you do that, it makes you look like a troll. So don’t be surprised when someone calls you one.

I don’t care that you don’t like the game and you make some valid points. Just stick to those and it’s all good!

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

You may not care that I, personally, don’t like the game but… big deal… there’s a much larger problem of 60,000 game accounts out there, and the in-game population being measured in the hundreds. So, by all means, don’t care what I think… but I suggest you start worrying what tens of thousands of other people think.

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Paulie Walnuts

You think I don’t worry? There’s a real concern when people don’t like the product. There are very real things to be concerned about and there are some big adjustments that need to happen to appeal to the masses. That’s obvious. But that doesn’t make the game terrible. It makes it mediocre. All we can do is hope that it becomes something great and only time will tell on that one.

Just to be clear also, when i said I don’t care about you disliking the game, I didn’t mean it as writing you off. I meant it in a sense that the fact that you don’t like the game isn’t why I’m going back and forth with you. That’s what I hope you understand going forward.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

One man’s terrible is another’s medicore. I’m sure we see the same thing, but express it in different ways. Also consider how disappointed some of us are… some because of what was originally promised… some because they are major LB fans and hate seeing his work fail… some because they invested A LOT of money and don’t see a very good game more than four years down the line. And so on. Sometimes combinations of all those things. That disappointment very easily turns medicore into terrible, depending on who you are and where you’re at with your relationship with SotA, honestly.

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Paulie Walnuts

Absolutely. I don’t blame you for having a bad taste in your mouth for not getting what you expected. It’s human nature when people are triggered to be quick to blast anything and everything that’s affiliated with what has them upset. I get it and I’m guilty also. It’s also very easy to say things that aren’t necessarily true when heated. I’m guilty there also.

“One man’s terrible is another’s medicore.” I agree, which is why it’s important to not let your disdain sway potential newcomers from the game. You said it yourself. You invested a lot and you have/had high hopes that that investment could measure up to your expectations. Doesn’t it seem kind of silly to push people away from your investment when you really think about it? How’s that going to help you get what you want? All I can say is try to find ways to help right the ship instead of sinking it. After all, you paid for it.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

I don’t feel I’m pushing people away. Indeed, many of my replies here say “don’t listen to me” or “don’t listen to that guy” and encourage people to play the trial. I think that’s the only fair way for someone to know if they like the game or not. Meanwhile, I will say I’m disappointed, and such, but I think any serious videogamer interested in MMOs or Richard’s work or whatever has given them the initial attraction to SotA, will still play it for themselves. If THAT lets them down, that’s not on me. That’s the game, unfortunately.

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Paulie Walnuts

You don’t feel like you’re pushing people away?

Try it! Please! Anyone who has played an MMO in the past decade… heck, even just a videogame in the past decade… will have no choice but to agree the game is terrible.”

” It plays like absolute crap.”

” The game is terrible.”

“Even if we generously double it to account for people using the shoddy launcher alternative to Steam, it’s under 1000 people. Terrible game.”

“Shroud of the Avatar… a game that promised a bunch of stuff at Kickstarter… turned into something else entirely… and is so underwhelming you can count the people playing, 500 days beyond persistence, in the hundreds.”

“Don’t you GET the Shroud devs have been stringing people along for years? During the beg-a-thons they say YES!”

I’m sure people are champing at the bit to take your advice and go download it after these wonderful endorsements. Let alone go into it with a positive attitude if they do.

In fact, I haven’t seen you say a single positive thing at all.

That’s where the break is between the people who are really mad and really criticizing. I can sit here and acknowledge the good and the bad. People that are all 1 sided on either side are kind of part of the problem IMO.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Like I said, I will say I’m disappointed, and such, but I think any serious videogamer interested in MMOs or Richard’s work or whatever has given them the initial attraction to SotA, will still play it for themselves. If THAT lets them down, that’s not on me. That’s the game, unfortunately. I mean, do you *really* think someone who wants to play Shroud will see a thread like this, with some people praising and some people saying it’s terrible, and decide not to take up the free trial? I don’t. I’m happy to bet on what they think AFTER they try it. But beforehand, I’d be surprised if any thread on Earth can turn off someone who wants to try and, not only that, what they want to try is FREE. It’s an absolute no-brainer to at least TRY.

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Paulie Walnuts

Of course I really think someone who is looking for a new game to play would potentially pass on considering Shroud of they saw hate reviews. I think that’s a naive way of thinking and find it kind of odd that you don’t all things considered. People make decisions based on reviews all of the time. I know I do.

I guess we can just agree to disagree and call it moot. We’re really just talking in circles at this point and it doesn’t seem either of us are going to budge.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Naive isn’t really a nice word to be tossing at me. I mean… what would you LIKE people, like me, to do? Do you want us to be untruthful and say the game is absolutely fantastic and everyone should try it? Do you want us to not say anything at all, except that everyone should try it? See, to me, neither of those are genuine responses from me. I’m not into giving non-genuine responses. I still think being honest that SotaA disappoints me *and still encouraging everyone to try it*, is perfectly valid. It’s honest, and I’m kinda into being honest.

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Paulie Walnuts

I’m sorry, I didn’t realize you were so sensitive. Every time someone disagrees with you isn’t an attack. You don’t have to take it all personal.

All the stuff you just asked I’ve already answered above.

This conversation is over.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

You’re still doing it. You take a dig that I’m “naive”. Now you take a dig that I’m “sensitive”. Am I throwing any similar words at you? Erm… nope. So why are you doing it? I’m arguing the case for what I believe. You’re taking personal shots at me. I find that odd. There’s absolutely no need for it. It hasn’t added to the discourse here.

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Paulie Walnuts

Did you not call me a kid? Don’t dish it if you can’t take it. Go ahead, keep playing the victim.

Some people might even call this being a troll. Don’t worry, I’ll just let it be.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Oh that was you, elsewhere in this thread? Looking back, even that was in reference to you using that silly schoolyard expression, “salty” in the first place – again, no need for you to have used it. Didn’t add the discourse. I was, however, more focused on the conversation we’d been having here, which was quite civil until, again, you started throwing out insults *that didn’t need to be there* and *which didn’t add to the discourse*. Not sure what part of this isn’t registering with you. Or, in your world, is it OK to throw out insults and, if the person you’re insulting gets annoyed, it’s somehow *their* fault? Because, I’ve gotta tell you, that’s a weird way of looking at the world.

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Paulie Walnuts

lol

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Paulie Walnuts

“So call me names all you like (I really don’t care!)” – Raleigh-St-Clair

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Ha! Thank you for highlighting the fact that I’m not sensitive – one of the insults you threw at me – by referencing what I’d already said, earlier in the thread. I will reiterate, however, that your insults *didn’t need to be there* and *didn’t add to the discourse*. Again, is this not getting through to you? I’m sure anyone bored enough to still be reading this thread will be wondering what’s wrong with you, that rather than discussing the topic, you’ve devolved into making insults, then scouring the thread for earlier comments… which, hilariously, back up my POV, rather than yours. Have a good one. Bye bye.

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Paulie Walnuts

LOL

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Oh, you mean why do I care about DISCUSSING SotA? Simple, Ben. I backed this game, at the time of Kickstarter, for a lot of money. Like many others (something which can be demonstrated via 60,000 game accounts and yet player figures are counted in the hundreds), I’m really disappointed with how it’s turned out – both in regard to what was promised at the time of Kickstarter and what it became… and also how the game plays in general. It’s very amateurish. So you can keep calling me a troll if you like, but from my POV I’ve backed this game heavier than the average punter, and I have opinions on it. It seems that stating an opinion that a Shroud cultist doesn’t like means being called a troll, no matter how factual the statements are. Such talk just makes you folk look silly and defensive but, as I keep saying, the real proof of the pudding is for anyone reading this to simply download the free trial and see for yourself. Is it amateur hour or a really great game? You’ll soon find out.

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temp starcitizen

Steam has only been selling access to the game since 2014. All those other accounts that bypass Steam are from Kickstarter – they don’t link their accounts because they want to sell them – that’s the only reason people don’t use Steam. The devs even tell people to use Steam because it’s better for updates. It’s ‘oxymoronic’ if you think about it. They don’t link their accounts to Steam because they want to sell their accounts, but no one plays the game.

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Paulie Walnuts

Yeah so? And if they sell them, they will be bought by someone else who plays. What’s your point? Pretty sweet deal. Play a game, sell it and make a few bucks. I don’t see the problem.

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temp starcitizen

When did they go beta? I thought they were still early pre-alpha.

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Paulie Walnuts

They went beta to draw in some new players to data mine for the new user experience. They wanted to get some feedback and watch trends so they could dial on trouble areas and make adjustments accordingly as they approached launch.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

I spend a LOT of time on the official forums and I’m not seeing any spam bots. Next?
Most players don’t log into the game through Steam but use the game’s own launcher. Also, you can only attach one account through Steam while many players, including myself have alt accounts that we play but not though Steam. Next?

solazur
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solazur

In the interest of fairness here…I’m pretty active; logging in more than 3x/week to actually play. I have more than one account ranging from a royal founder era account to the $20 Steam specials (2 of those) I haven’t used the sota launcher in ages. It’s far easier for me to do all the patching etc through Steam. I don’t think I’m the only one in that boat. Idk what % of the population uses steam.. but I’d be surprised if the graph looked much different (by which i refer only to trends) if you could overlay a native launcher chart on top of the steam charts. I would be in the camp that would stipulate and agree in advance that the current population is still low.. as I’d expect in a game that has not been actively advertising like one would expect from a game officially “released”. I”m not going to wade into the semantics here. On that topic I’ll just say this. I’m not one to rush in and start carving the roast beast before the one cooking it declares it done.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Duh, because the accounts were locked down and unable to post anymore, but left in the overall total to boost it. As for the use of Steam, it’s the premier games platform and updates a hell of a lot better than the Shroud launcher… which is why most people use it. But again, I’m happy to DOUBLE Steam’s figures to account for people using it, and we’re still in the hundreds. HUNDREDS. For a game 500 days beyond persistence. It’s a joke. So… um… next?

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temp starcitizen

oxymoronic ? Were you hired to write this? What’s ‘oxymoronic ‘ is that while they have 500k spambot forum members, they also have global publishing partners, and have been on Steam since 2014, and they only have sold around 50k game accounts since 2013. Look at steamcharts and you will see only about 120 people are playing right now.

What’s oxymoronic is that they call their game a MMO when really they’re a single players game but without a story and always online for the RMT. The world is empty, but you can still farm and sell gold and spam chat with your gold sales.

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Paulie Walnuts

I’m flattered you think I should be paid for my review. Maybe I could make a few bucks on the side.

So mad. They must’ve really done you guys wrong or something.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

Dude, if you don’t like the game, don’t play it. The effort you put into trying to bad mouth the game is getting a bit weird. Why do you care so much?
Side note: I haven’t seen ONE gold spammer ever.

solazur
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solazur

One might also call it oxymoronic to talk about gold sellers spamming chat in a game without a global chat.

‘jus sayin

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Ben Parry

I have nothing but good things to say about it :) been playing for a just over a year. I can say when I started playing when I bought into the game it was not worth playing. waited a year went back after the final wipe and it did have a lot of issues, but as we near release its now at the point where new players will like it. us old guys that have been playing for a long time will have to wait abit longer for new content for our levels but that is ok by me. Still plenty to enjoy.

They are not pushing us, they simply said if we want to vote for this game as one of the top to do so. not like they pushed us into anything. there is no reward for voting either. those that vote like myself simply love the game and see where this is all going and know what the future holds :)

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Alex Hoggett

It’s definately getting better. It still has some core problems like the mindless grind and lack of feeling of exploration due to instancing, but the towns and items are pretty cool compared to most games.

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Alleine Dragonfyre

No one can tell you that but you. Others that are curious, there is a free trial for you to try here: https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/?page_id=69568

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Nah, it’s still the same game it’s always been, at the heart of things. They tweak things here and there… they promise the world during beg-a-thons… they announce release dates and hype everyone up, then yank the dates… it’s been same old, same old for years now. We’re 500 days beyond persistence, too.

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Ema Nymton

I’m looking forward to the launch of Shroud of the Avatar.
The game keeps getting better. There’s a certain complexity and sophistication that causes a learning curve but ultimately delivers a deeper more immersive experience. As Port fleshes out the world more, it is coming to vibrant life. I can’t wait to see how it develops and what else they give us to play with.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

But it plays like absolute crap. Compared to what else is on the market, begging for people’s time and money, SotA is genuine amateur hour stuff.

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Ben Parry

says the guy who does not play it. Last patch the frame rate went up which was the first of the frame rate optimization patches. I play on a gaming laptop with no issues with everything maxed. 1070 GTX. The only time I have frame rate issues now is when I am in some player towns that have near 1000 décor in a single building. That will all be optimized over the next 4 patches which is 1st priority in the polish patches.

Raleigh-St-Clair
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Raleigh-St-Clair

Er… I’m a guy who played it until mid 2017 and has watched extensive streaming of it since. The game is terrible. And I encourage anyone reading this to not just watch some back and forth on the Internet by some bald bloke trying to deny reality and a bloke who posts links to Shroud’s own devs and gets called a troll for doing so… simply get the free trial and see for yourselves. The game does not stand up versus what else is out there. That is plain to anyone with a pair of eyes.

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temp starcitizen

I played a few times since they launched back in 2016. When they do their next launch I’ll try the free trial but I don’t have high hopes. I still log in and check things since they have a permanent free trial now. Game isn’t optimized and I can never get better than 14 or 20 fps. Add in lag and crashes and nope. Anyone that wants to be competitive though, everyone that’s been there since they went persistent will have a 2 year headstart. that’s not cool and for that reason alone I’ll never be anything more than a casual in this game.

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Ben Parry

Considering that is simply asking those of us that play to vote. if we like the game of course we will vote lol. If we win its because the community that voted care :)

Solaris
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Solaris

So is Crowfall and most every contender on the list. Your point?

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Alleine Dragonfyre

Any game developer that has any intelligence at all would be encouraging their fans to vote. Your point?

deekay_plus
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Patreon Donor
deekay_plus

crowfall is probably my least anticipated game and the more i’ve seen of it (gameplay footage) the past year convinces me it’s going to be outright terrible.

they also seem to be guilty of scope creep but without the whaling potential of star citizen. even despite their whale friendly changes to their pre launch cash shop.