Ask Mo: Jobs in the MMO industry, jobs in MMOs

Today, we’re reintroducing our general MMO advice column, here named Ask Mo: the column where you ask Mo questions, and he… lets me answer them for him because he doesn’t talk, see. That’s his thing. The first question is an oldie but goodie that arrived in our inbox recently:

I have always been a huge fan of MMOs, since the original days of EverQuest. I grew up, went to college and eventually got into the video game industry proper where I worked in QA. I have recently had to leave the industry to do what’s best for my family, but my passion goes unfulfilled: I never got to work on an MMO. I am limited in that I cannot leave my current location, but I still want to try to work with the MMO industry. My skill set largely revolves around project management and people management, so I don’t know what I could work toward doing in the MMO world. What I was hoping for was perhaps to glean some of your great knowledge of the MMO circles to perhaps provide some direction, some hope that I may still be able to get there some day.

Flee, flee for your lives!

Seriously, I love MMOs, and I love devs and players and games, but this is not a good industry right now. The recession and recovery has been very bad for us. (Unless you’re a Guild Wars 2 columnist at MOP. Then you’re virtually assured a position at ArenaNet eventually. I’m kidding. Mostly.)

The hard reality is that location is extremely important to the larger MMO studios (and even to some of the indies; consider that City State Entertainment only recently began taking on select remote employees). There are studios willing to hire contracted writing, community, and QA folks from afar — ArenaNet and BioWare have both been known to do that, for example — but those are usually short-term contracts that do not lead to long-term employment. They’re great for extra cash in hard times and look good on a resume, but they are not a career. This limits you if you’re unable to move to an online gaming mecca like San Francisco, LA, Seattle, San Diego, Austin, or DC. And please note that with the exception of Austin, all of the places I just named are extremely expensive to live in, so even moving there and landing an entry-level on-location job may or may not be a ticket to the monies.

Of course, that’s mostly for writing, producing, design, community, and QA roles, and those who can move and can afford the expense of living in high COL city should know that companies like Blizzard and Riot are nearly always hiring customer service and QA folks if you just want to get your foot in the door. Programmers, on the other hand, are in significantly higher demand. Artists and modellers are, too, of course, though those jobs are less likely to outlast the game’s launch. If you’re a programmer, you can make so much more money without the crunch hours and layoff cycle working in a non-gaming industry. And frankly, you should.

For the community and human resources roles you’re looking at, you can often get noticed and picked up as a blogger or YouTuber, but that’s a crapshoot, and frankly it’s harder to get a paid gig as a blogger than at a game studio these days.

If moving is out of the question and you really just want to work on an MMO, you could always consider donating your time to an indie studio. Games like The Repopulation and City of Titans are by gamers, for gamers, and a lot of them are always looking for help, sometimes in return for profit sharing. It may not be glamorous or lucrative, but it looks a hell of a lot better on a resume than nothing in these lean times.

The next question is job-related too, in a slightly different way. It’s from long-time reader Avaera, and I’m embarrassed to say I’ve pulled it out of our email bin from last May:

Where did all the community jobs go? My first introduction to an immersive online world was a little known 3-D chatroom of the late ’90s called Cybertown, and I remember the most engaging thing about it was earning in-game currency by getting a job as a welcomer of new players to your virtual neighbourhood or as a block deputy organising events and moderating your street’s bulletin board or dozens of other community-focused jobs.

Similarly, the most immersive games I’ve ever played were three text MUDs (Aetolia, Imperian, and Lusternia), and these have roles you can take on as newbie mentors for new recruits to your class, PvP champions for guildmembers who were responsible for warping in to rescue a weaker player if they were ganked, treasurers for managing city finances, diplomats for negotiating trade/conflict deals with other nations, events managers for guilds, and city-wide activities or political decision-makers responsible for maintaining/changing the cultural direction of an organisation. All of these had tangible systems and mechanical rewards built into the game experience, and you felt as though you were doing something involving other players that was more than just hunter-gathering for yourself. Almost every major MMO I’ve found has craft skills as the only real jobs available (aside from everyone being a mercenary), and they aren’t real roles in an interactive community, no more than a resource node or NPC merchant is. Can you recommend any lesser-known worlds that have these missing community jobs, or have they all disappeared entirely?

It’s strange how shifting from text-based imagining to graphical virtual worlds has limited our creativity and our options, but it’s happened all the same. In fact, I remember it happening in real time, as I once obsessed over the MUD Castle Marrach when EverQuest was in its heyday. EverQuest was so stifling and one-note compared to the playstyle freedom I’d known in Ultima Online, and I actually went looking for that feeling backward technologically to MUDs. Few MMORPGs have done better even since, so you’re not alone.

Of course, MMORPGs really can’t functionally do all of the things MUDs could do, and those that can certainly can’t do it as cheaply. There are older games that provide some of what you’re looking for; Ultima Online, for example, still has a counselor program, an event GM program, and player systems for city mayors and governance. There are sunsetted games that provide some of what you’re looking for too, like Star Wars Galaxies’ politicians and entertainers and industrial mavens and Vanguard’s diplomats (don’t even start me on the magnificent wonder of creativity we lost when Glitch sunsetted). Some modern games provide player councils, like EVE Online’s CSM, or judicial systems where players are judge and jury, like ArcheAge. Asheron’s Call, now maintenance-moded, still has a monarchy system that grants leadership experience to those who mentor newbies.

But finding them all in one game is virtually impossible. Our reality is that most modern MMOs are combat sims with some extra trappings, not world sims with combat added in. We’re not in an age when virtual worlds are being crafted at all, let alone explored to their fullest potential, and most — not all, but most — of the “sandboxes” on the market or on the way are blank slate MMOs, emptyboxes, rather than the heirs to MUDs and their everythingbox design-all-the-things mentality. And even some of the devs who made those once-great virtual worlds still haven’t acknowledged or internalized that and why a lot of gamers really do want to be Uncle Owen.

From personal experience, I can still recommend Ultima Online; there are few other games with deep-sea sunken-treasure fishing, glassblowing, true gardening with crossbreeding and mutations, and a political system (and it’s getting an expansion this year!). If I were looking anew, however, I’d set sail for a game like Wakfu, which includes player government and environment control, or Mabinogi, which features (among other more typical accoutrements) an aging mechanic, commercing skill, and musical composition system. Those MUD-like MMOs with depth and flavor beyond combat grinds are out there; they’re just vastly overlooked.

They’re also old hat to Avaera, I expect, so if any of you readers have more obscure suggestions, I’d love to hear them.

Are video games doomed? What do MMORPGs look like from space? Did free-to-play ruin everything? Will people ever stop talking about Star Wars Galaxies? Join Massively Overpowered Editor-in-Chief Bree Royce and mascot Mo every month as they answer your letters to the editor right here in Ask Mo.
SHARE THIS ARTICLE
Code of Conduct | Edit Your Profile | Commenting FAQ | Badge Reclamation | Badge Key

LEAVE A COMMENT

96 Comments on "Ask Mo: Jobs in the MMO industry, jobs in MMOs"

Subscribe to:
Sort by:   newest | oldest | most liked
SorriorDragneel
Guest
SorriorDragneel

I have a question for a good friend who might leave GW2 whata re some of the ebst wardrobe/costume systems out there? I know GW2 and RIFT have very good ones Wildstar has been upgarded but yeah she is wondering.

dorn2
Guest
dorn2

Mathew_Reuther dorn2 
You make a really good point about studios lying.  I’ve heard some real horror stories.  Companies taking money and not even working on the product they tangentially promised.  Messes like that are why we have foolish concepts like milestones.

MMO’s are a bit different though.  Even if they’re made by a studio they’re so huge that the people at the top are still money men.  Across the board none of them employ enough programmers.  Far too much focus goes on aritsts/level designers/etc.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

orionite I have never had an emotional experience on Amazon as a shopper. There’s a wide gulf between web software design with a pleasant, intuitive UX focus and the mission on Virmire in Mass Effect which combines every single discipline into one massive gut punch that the internet hasn’t stopped talking about since. Make sense?

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

dorn2 Cast and crew credits for something like The Hobbit: More Spec Fx Than You Ever Dreamed Possible and A Bunch of Kiwis Too show a pretty hugely diverse set of spcializations within film. I’ve been working with the crew doing the Back in Time documentary (closing out their second Kickstarter soon) and they’ve had quite a few people involved prior to going post, and they’re about to engage a bunch more people across various post studios. That’s just for a documentary.

But, hey, that’s really tangental anyway. I get your point and agree that there seems to me to be a disconnect between what money people understand about games and what the reality is. But I want to be clear that I think part of this lies firmly on the shoulders of the gaming industry. Being so needy for capital makes studio management lie their asses off to the investors at times when they should be telling the truth and educating the “money” as to what’s happening. I’ve been told point blank never to tell the investors the truth about x, y, or z by studio management. I loved the guys I worked with and thought that the majority of them were both pretty good people as well as talented individuals, but the “strong suit” of the companies I worked in was never absolute honestly.

And that’s where I think the industry could really improve. Maybe not total transparency at every single turn, but being honest about how things are going. If you look at a company like City State Entertainment you see a good example of being out there with what’s up in development land.

If more studios were being more forthcoming with things (at the very least to their investors) and more investors became aware of how things worked within the industry, there would be a greater set of resources available (call it common investor knowledge, the kind of thing you have with investment arenas like real estate, for example) that new investors could rely upon, and that studios could refer to.

It’s pretty hard to pitch something to people when there’s not the kind of institutional knowledge that builds up over a long period of time. (I mean if you look at “all” entertainment industries, games are probably the youngest outside of web-series, no?)

Games are complex things, and it’s easy to say “oh, yeah, games, my kid plays those…drives his car around in a circle” and of course that’s SO off base it’s not even funny. :)

dorn2
Guest
dorn2

Mathew_Reuther dorn2 
I was alluding more to the skillsets involved than the total complexity.  Most investors can’t really grasp that games need massive amounts of engineering.  It seems like even a lot of executives in large companies forget this fact.

djnesh
Guest
djnesh

Modrain dirtyklingon sadly, not only in the game dev industry

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Duke_W Do you think that Stephen King, in his younger years, felt constrained by the fact that his publishers had their own “tastes” in literature, or that making money sullied his writing? Do you believe that he, after decades of writing, dreads the new pages or new stories or feels constricted by all the ideas he has already put out into the world? Or do you think that he loves writing so much he’s always looking for new things to say and new ways to say it, like taking on writing for The Walking Dead’s 6th season.
Yes, hobby is hobby to some people, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t others who are professionals who enjoy what they do. Not everyone is “meant” to design games. But for those that are, the fact that they are doing so “for the man” isn’t necessarily the ball and chain you’re imagining.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

ManastuUtakata Yes, you have posted way more than I have. So has Damonville and paragonlostinspace. So have a lot of people. Some of them across every single comment section since the dawn of time (MOP) and some only in the ones that interest them.

Some people only post one comment ever on any given thing and don’t engage beyond that, and think that even bothering to reply isn’t the way to go. A lot of people don’t even have email alerts on.

Sometimes I go a week or so before I find a subject I have any interest in here. Sometimes I find multiple in a day that trip some thoughts. I comment in discussions I find the most interesting, and skip the ones I don’t. I typically avoid dropping gifs and clips into my replies here, favoring words over cute memes. I respond to most comments which ping me or reference me (like this one) and I post when I feel like, and how I feel like.

Almost as if I were an individual like anyone else.

So while you may think that the handful of times paragonlostinspace and I went back and forth below (4 or 5?) is “too many” … how might I then be responsible for him following me up into this reply chain?
He came up here after that exchange and threw out a number of comments (you have to hand count those..so, thanks for caring, bro?, I guess?) like it was some kind of victory. Like proving that I was interested in this topic (again, as someone who has worked in industry multiple times, not a shock) was some kind of smoking gun. You came in and reinforced that (heya, I’ve posted twice more at least since you commented, btw…) and then gave your own philosophy of “how to post”…to what end?
If the goal is for me not to talk (not sure why anyone is obsessing over that) then why @ me or continue discussion at all?
There’s a kind of irony in the fact that three people with fairly high post counts are involved in a thread which takes me to task for posting. The only one to even mention it was you. And you still implies that I was “doing it wrong” …
How about everyone just talk about the actual topic of the article instead of: berating people for posting, ignoring a line of discussion to instead make pointless insulting comments, call each other trolls, or play armchair referee.
There have been zero replies in this thread to my statement that professionals find pleasure in their work through their depth of understanding, in spite of that being a not-so-uncommon point in, among other things, various writings on game design. So the actual point I made, which is a salient one when contrasted with the assertion that working makes you hate things, has been buried under the bandwagon of “you shouldn’t post a lot” …
There’d be a lot fewer replies to page through if Damonville had actually responded with why he felt that my statement was off base instead of attacking my intellect.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Gibbins Mathew_Reuther Do *you* respond with “thank you, thank you” when called a troll for actively engaging in a topic that interests you, stalked across reply chains, and generally dicked with?
If so: that’s nice.

I don’t. 

This should be a crime? I don’t think so.

Look: Paragonlostinspace got bent because I pointed out that arguing against your own best interests and telling people how they should live their lives isn’t a good thing. He followed me up into this chain, and Damonville decided to post meaningless blather of biblical allegory couched as philosophical point and then act as if I was somehow too stupid to understand the depth of his profound statement. 

Me not rolling over and tucking my tail between my legs when confronted with that behavior doesn’t make me guilty of anything other than not being willing to get shoved around.

Me being willing to directly respond to people when they reply doesn’t make me anything other than willing to continue a discussion. If you are not interested in discussion, you probably shouldn’t be in a comments thread in the first place, so people acting shocked when someone is actually engaging in writing replies seems off to me.

Not everyone leaves one comment and calls it a day. (Both Damonville and Paragonlostinspace tend to post much, much more than I do. Both frequently are engaged in discussions which have “sides” to them, and both regularly go after others who disagree with them in their own way. That doesn’t bother me. But let’s not pretend that they’re not busy posting a significant amount or are all puppies and rainbows.)

Gibbins
Guest
Gibbins

Mathew_Reuther Wratts

I’m not that fussed who is right or wrong, but you do stand out as as someone with an especially abrasive style of presenting yourself to the community.

bambocheur
Guest
bambocheur

EBreezy I live and work in DC (feds) and it’s known as a tech hub (hundreds of startups). Browse #DCTech to get a buzz on the what’s happening.

Kherova
Guest
Kherova

I have to try some of the obscure games mentioned above. I really want to play a real and good sandbox!

EBreezy
Guest
EBreezy

nameistaken12 EBreezy  Yea, I used to live in DC, now I’m in MD.  There’s tons of places that get bad rap, but are actually nice places to live. I was born and raised here and I love the area, I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t scouting out other, less expensive, cities to raise my little family in.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

dorn2 Mathew_Reuther Sure. That might be selling films short though. They’re pretty immensely complicated affairs now. Particularly the ones that have a lot of post work. But yeah, games are intricate.

dorn2
Guest
dorn2

Mathew_Reuther 
Translation:  Investors think games are movies when they’re more like fancy buildings.

nameistaken12
Guest
nameistaken12

EBreezy City State Entertainment: Virginia DC suburb, Bethesda, Maryland DC suburb, Zenimax Online Studios, Baltimore, which might as well be a DC suburb.  And quite a few indie companies scattered about too.

EBreezy
Guest
EBreezy

DC is a gaming hub?! It just occurred to me that at least two studios are in Bethesda, MD.

Duke_W
Guest
Duke_W

Damonvile I was just thinking about this: My guild and I host huge community events in GW2… but would hate to do it for a living. Not only does the experience lose something when you feel obliged to do it to make money – but would also likely mean that any originality would be killed off due to having to adhere to the company line.

ManastuUtakata
Guest
ManastuUtakata

paragonlostinspace Mathew_Reuther 
I thinks it’s something more like 23 now…
…though I am the one to talk, as I posted over 950 comments since the month plus MOP has been released. Very few here even come that close. So consider me the uber spammer of spam.
That said though, I rarely comment on any given articles more than 3 to 4 times that interest me. I skip the ones that don’t. But I don’t try to make it habit of turning the comments into a sea of pink and pigtailed disagreements and obsessions. As I try to make it a rule, if I can’t get an agreement out of more than 3 replies, it ‘s no point in on continuing with the arguement.

orionite
Guest
orionite

Thanks for your replies. 

Mathew_Reuther , consumer software/saas is all about experience, as well, though! Think amazon.com, uber, flipboard, etc. 
kalex716 is it really that young? Seems we’ve had games almost as long as we’ve had personal computers and consoles, which is about 35-40 years, now. I certainly agree with you on the creativity angle. 
Modrain I work in Saas and have a CS background, so the fundamentals of the SDLC are familiar, but obviously focused on typical business applications. Depending on what your product is, you may need very specialized skillsets there, too. E.g. your big data guy, your integration expert, UX/UI (sadly much neglected in business apps) specialist, etc. but I see what you mean.

It still makes me think this is to a large part a problem of not acknowledging that this is a business first. I was just reading about the War for Overworld release and the team and work behind it. I’m happy that they made it so far, but it’s evident that there was a lot of navite among the team in terms of running a software company.

Again, thanks for your replies! Appreciate your points of view.

Tierless
Guest
Tierless

“And even some of the devs who made those once-great virtual worlds still haven’t acknowledged or internalized that and why a lot of gamers really do want to be Uncle Owen.” Cant agree more. If I want to be the hero I’ll play an RPG, they can do that better anyway. I play MMOs to live in the world of the IP.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Who is trolling who, exactly?
My contributions to this article’s comment’s section have been:
1) A note that I think indie dev is a better way to go at this point.2) The stance that gamers shouldn’t dissuade people from developing games.3) That some studios clearly are brighter with their management than others.4) That there are multiple levels to disciplines, and being involved with something as a job doesn’t relegate it to something you’ll despise as a result.5) That Raph Koster is a bright dude.
That’s it, aside from responding directly to comments like yours.
So, who is the troll? The guy who stomps in with “kid” or the guy who has laid out a number of different relevant statements regarding the article’s content?

Dreeb
Guest
Dreeb

Mathew_Reuther Appears to be your full-time job. Trolls on April 1st really do go out of their way. Kudos to you for all your inside knowledge, arm chair developer.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Dreeb Were you under the impression that “Just drop it, kid.” was going to have some kind of amazing effect on the universe?
Or was it just what the random internet toughguy saying generator whipped up for you?

Dreeb
Guest
Dreeb

Mathew_Reuther Just drop it, kid.

Nate Phelps
Guest
Nate Phelps

boredinBC I think too much blame is put at the studios’ feet on this issue. There are certainly horror stories, but the industry presents a brutal challenge to most traditional business models. Perhaps key developers should be signed to multi-project contracts the way that movie stars and directors are, but the development timelines for games make that difficult.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

As a starting point for reading more about game development (and in specific, from the perspective of an MMO designer) I’d suggest this: http://www.raphkoster.com/2012/03/15/the-best-articles/
There’s a huge amount of reading worth doing on game dev, including loads of books on the specific disciplines people might be interested in, but I personally find Raph’s stuff to be pretty good at covering a lot of the basics.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Damonvile Mathew_Reuther There’s a difference between actual coherent thoughts of your own, and continuous posting of platitudes, homilies, and philosophical detritus. Belief that you’ve said something profound is not proof of it, by any stretch, and no matter how many quotable tidbits you toss about, the fact remains that there’s more than a fortune-cookie’s worth of discussion in any given subject.
Do you disagree that a deeper understanding of the nature of a field reveals more nuanced levels which can then be enjoyed for their own sake, even though the veneer has worn thin?
Because I’m not hearing any coherent thoughts on the matter. I’m just hearing Yoda Yoda Yoda.

Damonvile
Guest
Damonvile

Mathew_Reuther Damonvile There’s a difference between meaningless, and I don’t get it.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Wratts Generally when someone follows someone else into a different stream you can be pretty sure they’re not doing well, in any case. :P

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Damonvile Sorry if me pointing out that the nature of understanding a field often changes how you view it but not necessarily the pleasure you can receive from it causes you consternation.
I was not aware that this would be cause for you to post meaningless allegory. I are afeard.

Wratts
Guest
Wratts

paragonlostinspace Mathew_Reuther Take it to tells guys.  Not sure who’s having the bad day, but please chill

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

paragonlostinspace Damonvile Mathew_Reuther I’m a “last word” type and you came up to this thread and hopped in with some baseless bullshit about me responding to everything “critical” … sure, man.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

paragonlostinspace Mathew_Reuther The first part of your original statement was true. As an industry veteran and a gamer I have an interest in the discussion in this thread. That’s not strange in the slightest.
The second part is where you being stoned comes in. I am responding to things I find of interest. It has nothing to do with anyone being critical of any specific point or no. If had actually read my comments, you’d know that was true.
So, either you’re baked, or you’re not quite as “done” as you said you were…

paragonlostinspace
Guest
paragonlostinspace

Damonvile paragonlostinspace Mathew_Reuther

Heh. Good one. Back to being semi productive and looking for a good shed to store my motorcycle during the icestorm/winter months. Damn ice.

Damonvile
Guest
Damonvile

paragonlostinspace Mathew_Reuther Some people will just never understand why we were kicked out of paradise for eating the apple of knowledge ( or what that even means…it has nothing to do with religion ;) )

paragonlostinspace
Guest
paragonlostinspace

Mathew_Reuther 14 comments out of the now 68 comments? Yeah whatever.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

You’re high.

paragonlostinspace
Guest
paragonlostinspace

Mathew_Reuther

Man, you are all over this thread. Countering anyone who says “anything” critical.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

Many game designers “play” less and find that when they “play” it is actually more like “deconstructing” than anything else. I wouldn’t say that it ruins the hobby so much as changes the nature of it. Instead of “playing” you are perhaps “exploring” the systems.
Reading fiction is a similar process for writers who have hit a certain level of understanding of craft. You don’t react as much to the emotional wave of the story, but to the deftness of the hand that steered the reader to that point.

Damonvile
Guest
Damonvile

The fastest way to spoil your hobby is to take it up as your employment. It’s called a job for a reason.

Modrain
Guest
Modrain

orionite Team-wise, building a game involves a lot more specialities than any other software (artists, sound designers, programmers, game designers, project manager, community manager, etc). From the go, you have to coordinate more people that need to communicate with other specialities.

Process-wise, you can’t just follow the usual scheme of having to fulfill a client’s wishes and play it agile. You still have to be agile, but in the R&D sense, because you need to create something fun, and that fun is not a feature you can write on a paper. There are a lot of trials until having the good recipe.

Code-wise, game programming is its own sub-part in programming. It involves techniques some programmers don’t even know about (graphic APIs, shaders, network programming, concurrency, CPU optimizations, etc). The average game is usually way more complex than the average consumer software, and often involves unique/new techniques as well needing R&D time. There’s a lot of innovation in game development. You might know names such as John Carmack’s one for this reason.

There’s also another reason, but this one is a really sad one. Like you can see above, games are something that need experience. There are too few veterans. Most are leaving the industry because of its conditions (to settle a family, because they’re bored of the layoff cycle or the salary, etc), and everytime, it’s valuable knowledge that is lost and need to be learned again by newcomers.

kalex716
Guest
kalex716

orionite Its a young, and creatively driven industry  rather than serving specific needs like traditional software.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

There’s a false expectation among many who fund the development of gaming that working in the industry is its own reward. You also see this in the regular encouragement of people to “just do it as a hobby” or “volunteer your time” which is the same as suggesting a musician play for two hours at a club “for exposure” …
Games are immensely complicated systems (when compared to the vast majority of software used elsewhere) and are, on top of that, art, which means they’re not just supposed to WORK, they’re also supposed to come with an EXPERIENCE.
That’s a hard thing to put together when you;re expected to work harder for longer for less all because you’re supposed to love what you’re doing.

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

I thought that your advice was pretty clear. I also think it’s poisonous. And for a gamer, short-sighted. (You supposedly love video games, so you think nobody should work in video games. Way to work against your own interests…)
 
I also think you’re clearly not aware of how psychology works if you believe that telling someone something is a bad idea is equivalent to pointing out the possible difficulties inherent in a specific path. The two things are entirely different, and no matter how you phrase telling someone something is a bad idea, you just told them it was a bad idea.
So, again: you are arguing against your own interests and telling other people how they should, according to you, live their lives.
We can only assume you tell your kids what they shouldn’t do and then tell them it’s their choice. Again: far from the only parent to employ this time-honored tradition. We surely have many a doctor or lawyer because of it.
But as a result of this “advice” if one of your kids goes 20 years bouncing around middling jobs before finally realizing that they SHOULD have been designing games the whole time, the world has been robbed of what, half a dozen of their titles because they got a late start?
I don’t see how telling people not to do something serves anyone’s interests. (Again, not the least reason being that as a gamer you’re arguing against people developing games…)

orionite
Guest
orionite

Since there seem to be quite a number of people here that know the gaming industry from the inside, I wonder if you can help us understand: Why is building games so much harder than building other consumer software or SaaS products? 
I’ve been a lover of games since I was a boy and have always been interested in working in the industry to “make my own games”. However, seeing the work/life balance craziness that seems to be the norm, combined with the very low salaries mean that I would have to make sacrifices I simply can not justify. I’m sure those with families and mortgages can empathize.

Zaeja
Guest
Zaeja

Thanks Bree! I’ve definitely tried most of the games you listed, but I must admit my inner graphical snob raised its perfectly rendered head a bit with UO… and I probably didn’t give the title a chance to show off some of those deeper features. I might load it up again this weekend.
I think one of the things that surprises me in general though is that being assigned a functional role in a game community was always incredibly ‘sticky’. It seems like such an easy way to provide a reason to log back in regularly, to engage with other players, and to invest in a title beyond simply collecting power-ups for yourself.
I get that design features that cost nothing more than a day’s worth of coding in MUDs can costs thousands in graphical MMOs, but given the flagging rates of player loyalty, it just seems like such a worthwhile tradeoff. I suspect that it might have something to do with the fear of developers that they produce something that might not be considered fun, casual and entertaining enough, but I think the pendulum has swung way too far to one side in that respect.

paragonlostinspace
Guest
paragonlostinspace

Mathew_Reuther paragonlostinspace You are being argumentative and ignoring the point I made that its advice. If you are asking my advice about the gaming industry in this case, I’d say run away! 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/advice?s=t

We’re done, I’m not going to argue with you ad nauseum because you have decided what I mean what I don’t mean. I think you are confusing a “command” with “advice”. We give our children advice, but we don’t command them not to do something.

Wratts
Guest
Wratts

doctordake I can only imagine the deathmarch SWTOR must have been at the end

Mathew_Reuther
Guest
Mathew_Reuther

paragonlostinspace You have confirmed multiple times that you believe advice includes telling people specifically what not to do. You have defended this as being the right way to go about things. I am not sure what impression you were tying to give other than telling people what not to do is the right way to go about life.

wpDiscuz